skyrider

Wierwille's statement about the black snowstorm would fall into this area. According to wierwille.....after he prayed in that newly renovated office in Payne, Ohio.......when he opened his eyes, it was snowing so thick that it was "pitch black, almost pitch black, outside." Now, some of us have questioned THIS..... for obvious reasons, one of which.....I've seen WHITEOUTS, but never a "black snowstorm." So then, some wierwille defenders come forward and say wierwille meant *it was black outside*....... or it was not literal. Never mind that wierwille didn't tell anyone about this for some 27 or 28 years! And, I'm still waiting for someone to explain about wierwille dying of cancer......since he taught in his advanced classes that CANCER IS A DEVIL SPIRIT. Howard's lame explanation that "Dr. Wierwille died of a broken heart" is totally debunked in the face of Wierwille's Death Certificate. Has twi retracted wierwille's cancer/devil spirit teaching??......

As the years go by.......seems like more splinter groups and ex-twi individuals are coming forward with their versions of wierwille's statements and doctrines. From "the law of believing" to "cancer is a devil spirit".......attempts are made to explain *what wierwille meant* when he stated it.......was it literal?.....or figurative?......or an analogy?.....or simply, a story? Will someone please write an exhaustive Wierwille Commentary.......with explanatory notes, annotations, or a treatise on a text narrative of wierwille's work? Please include your remarks and observations that are based on your personal experience and the context of that observation. I know, I know......it some ways, Ge-er already did this with 'The Passing of a Patriarch' and augmenting old teaching tapes written posthumously. So.........we have a Ge-erite version of a 'wierwille commentary.' Plus.......we have CES's list of things/statements that separate them from wierwille's twi-ministry. Plus.......it seems that CFF takes a 'soft-stance' on many pfal aspects. Plus.......here at GS, we have Mike's version of wierwille's 'lost teachings and truths.' Then......there are posters like oldies, whitedove, and others who 'dance around' and give their take on *what wierwille must have meant* when he said/did this or that. Has wierwille/pfal come FULL CIRCLE.....?? Remember in pfal when vpw stated that he got so tired of *reading around the word* that he hauled some 3,000 commentaries and books to the local dump? According to wierwille, he wanted to stop reading *what MEN say* and wanted to start reading and learning what the scriptures said..!!! Now, today.......the wierwille crowd STILL hangs on every word of pfal....as if, to say, this edited class was some type of 'divine revelation' that stands ALONE. At best, pfal contains scriptural truths from Leonard, Stiles, Bullinger, etc.... some truth, some error. At worst, wierwille set CROOKED CORNERSTONES in his foundational class and thereby, one is unable to 'draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith' [Heb. 10:22].......unable to be washed with 'the pure water of the word' and cleansed spiritually. <_<

Brushstroke......as you uncover twi beliefs, it should be noted that: 1) Some twi followers believe that wierwille's pfal class was given by divine revelation. 2) Some twi followers believe that wierwille's books give greater depth to the pfal class. 3) Some twi followers see wierwille's two sides (stage persona and carnal man) and still stand with twi. 4) Some twi followers rarely do any in-depth biblical research......but follow twi's chain of command. 5) Some twi followers follow the mantra.......even after errors and inconsistencies and plagiarism are noted. 6) Some twi splinter groups uphold SOME of wierwille's class......and DISMISS other parts. Welcome to the TWI-light zone...........

NOW.......whitedove tries to explain WHAT WIERWILLE MEANT when he wrote "the law of believing. :blink: NOW.......whitedove does NOT want to go by WHAT IS WRITTEN. :blink: NOW.......there seems to be a DIFFERENCE between the pfal class and the pfal books. :blink: NOW.......the 'dance around vpw's law of believing' TAKES ON NEW DANCE STEPS. NOW.......pass the popcorn and WATCH THOSE BACK-STEPPING MOVES IN ACTION.

Wierwille authored this book.....God's Magnified Word. Wierwille elaborated on "the law of believing".......read the above paragraph. Wierwille's book series is for his 'students' to learn detailed information on the 'more abundant life.' Wierwille's 'law of believing'.....is a UNIVERSAL law. It can be operated even WITHOUT HAVING A KNOWLEDGE OF GOD'S WORD. Again.......read above paragraph from his book. And, lest we forget from wierwille's corps program.......Corps Princle #4: Practice believing to bring material abundance to you and the ministry. At times, corps were shackled with the FULL RESPONSIBILITY OF BELIEVING for corps finances......or the rain to stop at corps week.

NOTE: THE GREAT THINGS OF THIS WORLD are available to men and women who know how to operate ONE OF GOD'S LAWS, namely the law of 'believing equals receiving.' Is Wierwille's name on this book?

Then why was wierwille's name on the beige book.....?? Quotes below.

EXACTLY. Whereas.......the one who bought into pfal's "law of believing" distorts reality with justifications of mental thought processes far beyond his control. He fails to differentiate between 'God at work' and this 'Savior-less law of believing' [that works for saint and sinner alike].......and, thereby, is always striving to attain 'this mountaintop believing' all by his lonesome self. Remember??.....if he could fully 'renew his mind'....then he could live forever. In the end.....this 'law of believing' when traveled to its furthest extent is man trying to be 'a god.'

One person took pfal......one has NOT. Can you tell the difference?? :)

So.......wierwille's extremism is NOT representative in wd's post.....BECAUSE in accordance with scripture the statements in wierwille's orange book, blue book, and beige book are NOT TRUE..??? In other words.......wierwille's "law of believing" is off on another tangent and is FALSE PROPHECY. Surprised?.......NOPE, not at all. THAT'S WHY many of us are here at GS......to expose the evil and error in wierwille's ministry.....and since "the law of believing" was one of the main ingredients to wierwille's recipe for a "believer's success"........it leads back to wierwille and his FALSE DOCTRINES. Thanks whitedove..........you get the Greasespotter Award this week.

oldies.....you hold to wierwille's explanation because, you say, it makes more sense than the others. On a side-topic of 'death'......could you explain to me how wierwille died of a cancer-devil spirit? Did wierwille let his guard down and get possessed by this cancer spirit...........and then, it killed him? Seems like I've asked this SEVERAL times......and no wierwille-defender wants to answer it. :)

And furthermore.........many days, lunchtime announcements included snippets of *worldly* news AS SEEN through martindale's unique and unparalleled 'understanding' of the devil-spirit realm.

Well.........taking some notes from ge-er: If the roman catholic church can title the pope as Patriarch of the West ...........surely, ge-er and twi can title wierwille as Patriarch of The Way.

PB.....I don't know, seems like it works for the dalai lama, buddist monks and tibetans, no?

Thanks cowgirl. I read this story a year or so ago.....but didn't see this re-enactment of it. :)

Seems that wierwille's titles progressed through the years to the point of "biblical ranking".......comparitively, to a "modern-day Apostle Paul." When I took pfal...............vpw was The Teacher. When I went corps............vpw was THE Man of God. Just prior to vp's death......vpw was Our Father in the Word. 22 years later...................vpw is immortalized in twi as "Our Father in the Word"......seems like the other titles have fallen away and he is idolized right up there with that *biblical ranking* of the Apostle Paul. Of course, this title carries three references in one: 1) Our Father.....(don't mix this up with *Our Father who art in heaven*).....but, one who has begotten (spiritual) children; 2) the Word......not just any "word" but *THE Word*; and 3) Updates the Paul reference to a modern-day *twi title.* Could twi possibly bestow a greater title to vpw to idolize his name?? :blink:

Huh? whitedove......usually, you take the stance that "the corps commitment was to stand with twi a lifetime." You know.....the signing on the line thingy. Now.....you seem to be saying that the program (twi) has failed and corps are to honor their part by making individual choices to serve God a lifetime with their desires and abilities. THAT'S WHAT I'VE BEEN SAYING. Howard's response to these First Corps..........threatened them with legal action (trespassing) if they set foot on twi property......in other words, twi considers them "dropped corps." Now, do you see why this "labeling" is a bully-club that twi always uses on corps?

socks.......it's that *impression* (with NO real specific facts about John Mark) that I alluded to in my first post. To me......here's the irony: 1) Many times on GS......some wierwille-defenders make comparisons of wierwille "being like the Apostle Paul".....in that, supposedly, he got this revelation like it hadn't been known since the first century. 2) Wierwille mentions Peter Wade in pfal......that little booklet on righteousness that Wade did. And, ironically.....I do not recall wierwille mentioning anyone else in pfal as his "right-hand man" sorta speak. 3) Wade "quit" following wierwille's ministry and started his own ministry. 4) Whitedove posts this little article about "quitting" on the About the Way forum........not the Open forum. Seems that he thought more would read it there. 5) To a degree, I understand the point of the article and what whitedove is saying.........but it seems to have a negative slant. And, for scripture to not specify why JM left........leaves more questions, than answers. 6) And.......with John Mark committed to the work.....and penning the gospel of Mark......could it have been "the right thing to do" in his walk with God at the time to *disassociate* with Paul....???? 7) IMO.......it seems like Barnabus was a dynamic man "to hang with" ....... so maybe, the Paul & John Mark "two-by-two system" just wasn't working out. Is that supposed to be a big deal? Is that "quitting" on God? 8) And, finally........were Way Corps supposed to walk step-for-step with wierwille/twi a lifetime? I find it interesting that when the 20th anniversary of the FIRST CORPS REUNION took place in Ohio......Bo and the gang didn't label it an "Ex-corps Reunion." :)

No relation to The Way..????........how about opening this thread in the About the Way forum. <_<

Actually.....Shroyer started cff in '95 or '96 soon after his tenure in florida. In his traveling around, he sat at kitchen tables with hundreds.....listening to hearts of those damaged and abused by twi. Wayne came on board in '98...... after the "scandal of the martindale/married corps woman at the 1998 adv class at hq" came to the forefront. Yes......

Was there a difference between being a WOW..........and a WOW veteran..? Then.......there was a push to send WOW veterans to "spiritually-dark" cities. Any wow vets who signed up for ANOTHER YEAR of active duty were commended.

According to definition, here are a couple: 1) experienced, practiced [past term acknowledgement of learning] 2) designating or of a person who has served in the armed forces. At the time I went thru twi's 4-year program.......2 years of gaining exposure, experience (witnessing, classes, etc) and 2 years in-rez (with light-bearers, lead, research paper, teaching, etc)

Like I said in my opening post...............selling those way corps vet t-shirts in twi's bookstore was an indication of how the trustees viewed the CORPS PROGRAM. For a few years, we had *completed our tour of duty, obligation to the corps program*.......now as veterans, the choices were ours. According to the trustees......we had completed our mission of learning and now, it was up to us to go forth. The options in assignments were ours. Yet.............within a couple of years, twi stopped selling those t-shirts. And, by 1984......the screws were tightening again around us to TAKE TWI ASSIGNMENTS..........else, the labeling and slander started. After all............victor paul wierwille was a "quitter" if one chooses to look at little slivers of his life. He quit the payne ohio church. He quit the van buren church (some think he was terminated)..........but of all the things in wierwille's life, I would not label him a *quitter.*............nor would I label any corps grad *a quitter.* Further.........martindale mandated, in 1995, that all active corps take full-time employment FROM TWI..........or else, they would be *dropped* corps......and be labeled *corps alumni*.........another changing of terminology, again. When the First Corps had their 20 year reunion in ohio.......and made known that they wanted to stop by hq for some memories, some pictures.........howard allen threatened legal action if they stepped foot on twi property. Nice, howard............that's the kind of action Jesus would take, right?...............NOT.

Actually, I prefer to view John Mark as a holy man moved by the spirit of God to pen some awesome truths and accounts of the Lord Jesus Christ. Nor do I care to *attach an insignificant label* on a small sliver of a man's life. You can call him whatever you like........ but I prefer to step back and look at *the sum of a man's whole life. When there is continuous, habitual pattern.......then, yes......."labels" have a way of sticking. When carnal patterns of lust, drunkenness, strife, lying, hatred, idolatry, etc.......consume and take up residency in a man's life..........then, yes........to me, it certainly becomes a teaching point of "the man of the flesh." Otherwise, stuff like this reminds me of Matt 7:3.....And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? * Note.........I did NOT post on the John Mark thread, nor does it need further discussion on this thread. ** In starting this Way Corps Vet thread......my point was to address this corps vet *label* and how it impacted individual corps and the overall message it conveyed.

Maybe it stands out to me from all those twi labels......cop-out.....possessed..... greasespot......mark/avoid Labels have a way of *sticking*..... Unless God labels one "a quitter"........why should I add it? Is "being a quitter"........worse than "being a cult follower?"