skyrider

Yeah......wierwille is a "legend" of his own making. The old "snow on the gaspumps" story.....told to the corps decades after it supposedly happened.....has the fabricated fabric that legends (myths) are made of. Seems to me...........the bible is very specific on identifying A MAN OF GOD in the old and new testatments. Words did not cut it. Classes didn't either. The man (or woman) speaking for God demonstrated the power of God via signs, miracles and wonders. The scriptures are clear to point out that false prophets were exposed.......as their words were without merit and fell to the ground. Heck, ole wierwille died of cancer.........which HE CLAIMED CANCER WAS A DEVIL SPIRIT. Nice legend.

Yeah.........I'd agree with much of this. And, really.........how many of us teenagers and young 20-somethings allowed wierwille and co. to be the dominating center of OUR UNIVERSE? Some of those twig fellowships lasted like 25 minutes.......and we were off doing something else. Really.........the wierwille idolatry and pyramid structure was NOT all that big of deal. BUT...........in hindsight, I find it disgusting to see the gritty details of wierwille and his board buddies. The manipulative tricks, the motorcoach approach, the plaigarist panhandling, and mog smog........wierwille and upper hierarchy were the antithesis of the gospel/epistle records. Sure, I saw red flags time and time again.......but took the view of "not thinking evil of other believers." They have no power over my life, my memories. In the end.........."I'm thankful I am the man I grew to be."

I seriously doubt that twi is financially "in trouble"..............BUT, they've learned to rein in payroll and overhead expenses at the first sight of a downturn. After all, twi prides itself on financial stewardship.........and trims the staff ranks whenever the finance dept shows the "directors" a snapshot of the money picture. Howard Allen used to jump on his soapbox about controlling expenses......it's the area that twi can CONTROL from a stewardship perspective. Of course, preaching it to the staff......and DOING IT PRIVATELY, are two different things. Even with their "millions"............twi is such a small insignificant outfit in cornfield ohio. Except for a small percentage of followers/ex-followers......99.99999999% of the world has never heard of it.

No longer can twi hold The MOG Status as a manipulative tool to deceive the masses. IMO......even "the wierwille myth" is gaining a foothold into the long-standing followers' psyche as the carnal, plaigarist, drunkard, lustful wierwille stories see the light of day. No longer can twi hold The MOG Status as a club..........heck, even rosie claims the titleship of *chairperson of the board.* The hypocrisy is so thick that some must have to keep their giggling in check, at times. No longer are newbies lured into the trappings of The Man of God of the universe residing at the way international in this day and time. At best..........twi's bod desperately clings to the wierwille myth for financial survival.

Wierwille and co. had NO ANSWERS on proper child-rearing.......ie twi was not even in the ballpark when it came to walking in love, walking in light or walking circumspectly. Thankfully, I was never in the Family Corps.......just regular corps. Don't think I ever would have ever absorbed the indoctrination of having *some other parent* hit my kid with a wooden spoon over and over again. All those corps coordinators...........were blinded by wierwille's delusional doctrines. As the younger generation reaches adulthood...........the twisted doctrines of twi come into full view.

CP 1,2,3,4,5 1. Acquire an in-depth spiritual perception and awareness. .......wierwille stood at the top of the pecking order and would tell you when/if you "acquired" it. 2. Receive training in the whole Word so as to be able to teach others. .......receive indoctrination and go get your family and friends (multi-level marketing). 3. Physical training yada yada.... .......needed a category to justify the work/slave program in corps and flo. 4. Practice believing to bring material abundance to you and the ministry. .......subtlely injected at #4...MONEY was/is the core issue of the self-serving org. 5. Go forth as leaders and workers in areas of concern, interest, and need. .......the LEASH that twi assumes to hold a lifetime over the corps. <_<

To clarify a little more...........added (bold type).

I've stated this before, but...........I think ROA was cancelled because of MONEY. In March/April 1995 martindale stated that he got "revelation" for all the corps to be full-time. Bobble-heads Don and Howard nodded in agreement. All active corps would be placed on twi payroll and meet with twi's PR/Finance point-man at Corps Week 1995. Thus, going forward...........EVERY ROCK OF AGES would have all corps as paid staff (travel expenses, motel stay-overs, food, gas expense, children-in-tow, etc. etc. etc) year after year. Three weeks after the 1995 roa, when martindale addressed the corps on the first corps phone hook-up of the 1995-1996 year, he bluntly stated the NEW RULES AND REGULATIONS for corps expenditures. He cancelled the rock of ages....giving the lame excuse of "teenagers screwing in tent city"......and FUTHER STATED that no corps would attend the November Word in Business Conference unless specifically "invited." In other words, WE DO NOT WANT TO SPEND ABS MONEY FOR YOU CORPS TO ATTEND WORD IN BUSINESS.......OR ANY FUTURE ROA. The emphasis of the corps meeting was to set precedence on MONEY issues..........it was SO OBVIOUS.

Have you seen this? This is very interesting.........what do you think? On youtube.......Muslim Demographics: The Islamic Tidal Wave Not sure how to link this but..............http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XK1pnCldKZI Thanks.

waysider........I tend to think that we sometimes give vic far too much credit. The beginnings of roa was a no-brainer...... some music, teenagers and youth sitting on the grass, tents and stay-overs, all adding to a preliminary setting for vp's preaching session and added adulation. As rock of ages grew and morphed......its core element was the sending forth (and homecoming) of the wow ambassadors. Beyond that.......twi had very few answers to families attending roa, childrens' activities, first aid precautions, shower facilities, mid-day lulls of activity, etc. In retrospect, to me......twi's roa had the same "planning" as the hodge-podge trailer park on grounds. Wierwille was no visionary...........all those "plans" for camp gunnison -- cabins for elderly followers, a restaurant up on the hill overlooking the gunnison river, horse trails, etc. etc. -- all those lofty "plans" fell flat. Not one senior twi follower bought into the idea (scam) of investing in a log cabin and reliquishing it to twi property upon death. Wierwille's *snow-way*......... the super, duper all-terrain vehicle that those two family corps guys spent some 18 months working on for wierwille never panned out. What ever happened to the 13 episodes of High Country Caravan that were to be released for tv public viewing? The interest in this entertainment outside twi-land was very minimal......as I recall. IMO, wierwille had a 15-year run (1968-1983) that *dazzled* us youth.......and struggled with his identity and health issues in '84, '85 and flew off to see geer prior to his 1985 May death. BUT.......the "programs and visions" that he set in motion were short-lived. Twi had NO ANSWERS for families, for professionals, for adaptability..........the plaf class was the end-all STAGNANT ANSWER to everything. Just run classes......"they will come."

From 1978-1984......as I recall, the attendance increased from like 16,000 to 23.000 and radically decreased after the 1986 pop paper and exodus.

Along with 'brick brushing 101'...............add toilet paper 101. Is it "best" to have toilet paper dispense "over the top" or "underneath?" Can one sufficiently wipe with just 3 squares of toilet paper tissue? Is that "hotel hospitality" (making a little triangle to show you care) really necessary? <_<

You gotta remember......lcm was "crowned" by wierwille himself. Wierwille handpicked this guy.....and wierwille walked by revelation doncha know? lol Heck, some left twi only to follow the insanity of geer.......or the arrogance of lynn. <_<

Yeah......I'm fully aware my farming background gave me a totally different perspective than what others experienced, learned, etc. It's just that......I was EXPECTING SO MUCH MORE from corps "training" and the juvenile indoctrination, treating all of us like know-nothings, grew tiresome and irritating. Heck, I was pulling 24-foot discs, rod-weeders, chisels, and other implements behind my dad's John Deere tractor when martindale was out pushing his 24-inch lawn mower. <_<

Along the same lines as *chair stringing 101*.............let's not forget Grass Mowing 101. Remember that corps promotional video (1981.??) where one of the key-noted corps-style confrontations is martindale lecturing on "attention to detail" to some 10th corps guy who missed a narrow strip of grass? Yeah....that's the ticket on this PROMOTIONAL VIDEO TO THE CORPS.......martindale sharing on something he has expertise in.......grass mowing. It was sooooooo juvenile.........so ridiculous. From my farming background experiences and driving a tractor at the age of 10..............this promotional video bordered on the absurd. Same thing as *weed pulling* during those 4-hour work shifts. Like so many things twi.........this video was trashed after a short run. Wonder why???..........lol Mowing grass..............on a corps promotional video..................hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.

For many who went thru corps "training"...........they never figured out how to separate the anal indoctrination FROM the practical application of love and common sense. Call me a rebel.............but in my 17 years as a corps grad, I never utilized *chair stringing 101 in any meeting or twi function in 'my area.' As an area coordinator.....and, later, a limb coordinator for six years, I was fully invested in the 'eyeball it and call it good' method.

Fear of death?...........not really. I waited to see if twi's voodoo had any punch to it...........nope. <_<

Not sure about the who part...........but when I was responsible for BRC setup, we devised a system that took about FIVE MINUTES to align the chairs. When the BRC lighting was set a certain way all those little chair 'divets' were clearly visible and we'd simply adjust the chairs back into those little divet spots. No strings, no fuss......our crew loved brc setup, it was the easiest block assignment at hq.

Patriot.........yeah, this topic came front and center a few years ago when the bod were, seemingly, strict about this 'mortgage debt' issue. At the time, if I remember correctly, one corps/clergy couple in Tampa had this parent-signed mortgage arrangement........as well as a reported limb couple in Indiana. It is my opinion that twi picks and chooses its "battles".........and wanted to tread lightly on 'leadership mortgages' because they didn't want to shake the bushes any more than necessary. After all, the abs numbers must be on the slide quite drastically.........can twi 'afford' to lose more people ($$) even if they have mortgage debt? Twi is like a good-fellas club..........they willfully turn away from confrontation when 'friends and chums' are involved.

This is the CURRENT synopsis of twi's "advanced" class special........and of rosalie's toxic oppression. How pathetic........teachings were about 3rd grade level, rosalie has "dumbed everything down in the last few years, it's worse than going to church and fear-trips going on. Yeah.........CURRENT happenings in this class-based FEAR ZONE. In April 2000......martindale was exposed as a sexual predator and twi, under legal advice, stripped martindale of his presidency, clergy duties, and way corps status and ousted his arse under the cover of secrecy.....which later was found to be toledo, ohio. Nearly 9 years later.......and Rosa-lie has DONE NOTHING FOR TWI except to implement rules and written reports and script-reading at its weekly services. Worse than church????............yes, it's a cult.

Wouldn't there have to be a mass of followers...........to have a mass-exodus? If those anemic "advanced class specials" don't chase 'em off.............old age will.

WOW............not a peep! :blink: An Advanced Class Special..........at The Way International........and NONE of the "directors" was inspired (cough, cough) to address the attendees with heart-felt appreciation, a special "prophetic message" for the moment OR.....they just walk in lockstep fear to rozilla's scowlisms. And, if rosie ain't into "sharing".........then they should all take note. Sheeesh. Nothing like going to an "advanced" class special......and seeing the "directors" walking on egg shells.

And.......what does THAT mean..????? SPECIFICALLY, what has she healed? Are we talking "soothing over the damage control caused by lcm?" Did she "heal" the ministry by bringing ole veepee's doctrines back into focus? Is micro-managing people and brow-beating them into a sense of like-mindedness......is that the "healing" she has administered? And.........wouldn't it be highly suspect that any "prophecy" over rosalie carry any relevance in a defunct, immoral, and corrupt organization? What some would call "healing".............others would call COVER-UP. <_<

I heard that a long-standing couple in southern California left twi in the past two weeks. :)