skyrider

And.....doing the EXACT OPPOSITE of the pfal teachings. Yet.....rosalie proclaims to uphold wierwille's ways.

Yes, international countries work independant of NK....with respect to money. BUT........THE SIGNING OFFICERS IN CANADA'S DOCUMENTS: 1) Rosalie Rivenbark, 2) Roger Mittler, and 3) Jean Yves-DeLisle The country coordinator of canada, J0e Pxrry, has a signature listed on the paperwork as well...but not, as "a signing officer." MORE TO THE POINT --- TWI DIRECTORS ARE THE OFFICERS/GUARDIANS OF THE BUSINESS ENTERPRISE, THE CAPITAL, THE MONEY.

The qualifications of a minister are in I Timothy 3......some don't qualify. With today's technology and culture, many of these "ministries" reach long-distant followers. From that respect, how much ministering really goes on except for a teaching tape and the occasional phone call? To each his own, I guess......but I tend to think that past associations and manipulation play a part in some of this splinter stuff. Why is it that these ex-twi "ministers" keep going back to their rolodex files/phone numbers of ex-twi followers? WHERE IS THE NEW GROWTH? WHERE ARE THOSE REVIVAL MOVEMENTS OF NEW CONVERTS? Just saying......it mostly seems like business networking.

Aw, yes.....Zaire. Back in the early 80s, twi was courting Zaire with much fervor......Rev. T0m KnVpp was overseeing the African continent, and he (and wife, Marilyn) lived in Africa for about two years. Rev. Byunga (??) was the country coordinator and spoke on main stage at roa. Andre Z. and Roger L. went into the 12th corps....and after ordinations, returned to Zaire in major leadership roles. With culture and social and economic levels per se, thousands would sign up for twi classes......looking for avenues of opportunity and advancement. Extended families and relatives came pouring into the classes. More and more, Zaire under Byunga's leadership was breaking away from twi's hq. Byunga could not be reined in.....and he scoffed at their petty policies. Other african corps grads were ordained and were appointed "limb coordinators" over cities in Zaire (iirc). After Cgeer's power-grab in 1986/87......Zaire was rarily talked about in way mag articles. In the late 90s (??)......Rev. Andre Z@kompanie died. He was a really neat guy. I will always remember him and Roger working at hq during their inrez years......communicating in broken English, talking in French, singing in Kikongo and joking in Lingaula (sp?). In the end, twi frowned on any work that was moving towards INDEPENDENT WORK. Twi has motives of centralized control, period.

EXACTLY. Year after year, wierwille proclaimed that "one serves the people BY TEACHING THE WORD." And, then he'd go to a couple of selective verses that stated as such.......BUT what about all those other points where Jesus fed the thousands with loaves and fish? when Jesus spent all night in prayer to the Father? when Jesus cast out devils and the man was made whole? when Jesus heard the pleas of Mary and Martha and raised Lazarus from the dead? etc. etc. With so many......"the word" must be upheld at all costs. The condescending attitude is so thick you can cut it with a knife. Their actions speak so loud, I can't hear a word they're saying. That's why, for me, I endeavored to roll up my sleeves and help others with life's challenges. Even as a limb coordinator, I often would assist in moving furniture, loading moving vans, painting, setting up meeting rooms by myself, etc. etc......to undo the heavy burden of others. It just wasn't right to expect this entitlement from others. And, today's splinter proliferation is just another extension of a power-grab. Heck, all of us can teach the bible.....right? Geez....I've heard enought bible that I could sit down and put together a teaching while watching a football game. So?????? I'd rather see a sermon than hear one any day !!!

Where are the George Muellers ??? Where are those who hazard their lives for the gospel's sake ??? Where are the Hebrew 11 types who stood against defying odds ???

In today's culture and technology, the proliferation of propped-up preachers and programs is a business market on the rise. With computer and website, anyone can stand on his "pulpit" and sound-off. Back in the 1920s, my grandparents attended home-churches that had an itinerant preacher who came once a month to their rural community. Back then, imagine the drastic contrast of sacrifice for his dedication and commitment....as compared to today's culture. With meager offerings, a hot meal and warm thanks -- the intinerant preacher was a rare breed. Today......the "preachers and programs" are not only on every street corner, but can be in house-after-house before you get to the street corner. The next "hot teaching" can be yours with just the click of a mouse....or your donation for the weekly dvd. What's more......the non-profit status is a gold mine for easy living. More than ever before, we are seeing an America "in which everyone tries to live at the expense of everyone else." On another thread, it looks like JAL is striking out on his own to start his own ministry. Why should this surprise anyone? The list of wierwille's corps guys attempting this.....is numerous. I will never forget the day in 1982 when asked to speak with Vince F. at his hq-office......and upon entering, there he sat, in the middle of the afternoon, playing cards with another twi leader. Oh.....and the playing cards were those with all the naked ladies on them. And, silly me.......at the time, I thought this was just an isolated incident.

John Lynn splitting out......to run his own gig. Oh, my! Why does this not SUPRISE me??.......Wierwille did it.......Geer did it......the guys in Geerite movement did it. This offshooting of offshoots has been going on A LONG TIME. NOT SURPRISED.......NOT ONE BIT. :B)

You know things are screwed up when.... 1) Wierwille teaches that "all women in the kingdom belong to the king." 2) Corps women are instructed that "serving the mog sexually" is one's duty to God. 3) Cgeer mandates that anyone found having read Schoxnhe1t's adultery paper will be fired. 4) Walter Cummxxs claims that a research paper on adultery is NEW RESEARCH. 5) Martindale issues a loyalty letter for compliance to twi. 6) Splinter groups nation-wide structure *their* group in the reflected glory of pfal. 7) Gullible people follow the same scam and teach their children to do so (also). 8) Personal prophesies of nose-spiders arise in another christian EDUCATION service. 9) Another pilot program, SOWERS, is modeled after the defunct grandpa corps program. 10) The tail of legalism is wagging happy-go-lucky dog. :o

In twi wayspeak......"present truth" is a truth that changes with every present situation "Present Truth" is much like the marxist's equal to "permanent revolution" (change).......like it's permanent but always changing.

ABSOLUTELY ! The scam........a christian veneer of verses and petty platitudes The business....siphon off the working class' hard-earned money in ABS The pyramid.....wierwille-idolatry, an elitism march towards oblivion

Yeah.....why is it twi leadership always think the answer to any situation is MORE twi leadership and intervention? Like the famine in Acts 11........what if during this recession and double-digit unemployment, twi announced to their followers to STOP SENDING IN ABS FOR ONE FULL YEAR ??? Yeah, right?.....like that would ever happen in a thousand years. How could twi hq possibly survive with only 48 MILLION in the bank and investment savings or stocks???

BUMP Relief is...on The Way (tongue-in-cheek) --- NOT In my opinion, twi-followers are becoming more and more skeptical of twi's rhetoric. Those on the field and far away from a bloated staff of "spiritual advisors"......WHY SEND THEM MONEY? Especially, as the unemployment rates climb into the double-digits....and week after week "fellowships" just regurgitate the same spewth.....THIS IS INSANITY, doing the same thing over and over and over again, expecting different results !!! Sure......numbers are plummeting, adv class attendance is pathetic, corps program is dismal. What about family camps at gunnison????? Any reports? My guess is that very few want to spend their hard-earned money to travel to ANOTHER twi facility. Imagine, spending all kinds of money to travel there, take your vacation.....and then, twi wanting "another love-offering" as you drive away???? Even in the 80s and 90s.....when the economy was much stronger, twi struggled to keep classes going. Can you imagine how BLEAK THE ATTENDANCE MUST BE NOW ????? :blink:

BINGO !! And.....going down the list of other classes, what about?.... The Way Tree class............chain of command and recruitment? The Renewed Mind class........groupthink, suppression of self and critical thinking? Christian Family and Sex......husband is lord over wife, and sex, sex, and more sex? Keys to Biblical Research.....some help, but always stick with wierwille's pfal foundation? Dealing with the Adversary....spirits are everywhere trying to sidetrack you from twi, "the word?"

Ham.....you certainly have a point, but other facts add insight to this. 1) According to Mrs. W's book.....when vpw called Leonard about getting into his class, Leonard refused wierwille (on the phone) and told him no. 2) Leonard confronted wierwille at the door.....when vpw show up at the Calgary class. 3) Somehow wierwille talked his way into the class..........Leonard's mistake. 4) Wierwille was thrilled with the class.....and repeated it, with Mrs. & Don & others, in June. 5) Not until much later, did Leonard realize that wierwille was teaching his class. Wierwille's true colors started flying high (plagairism, stolen material, not crediting Leonard).....and Leonard started copyrighting his material. 6) The Way Ministry is a splinter group of B.G. Leonard's ministry. :blink:

Well.....after wierwille wrecked it in 1983, the Flight Services guys and 'special assistants to vp' spent a week with repairs and new paint job. Along with this, extra decals, pin-striping and ultra-detail were added.....thereby, wierwille's 'club guys' took the twig-hopper to several shows and won top honors. Few people.....ever knew that it was wrecked. Few people.....ever knew that it was entered into motorcylce shows. The wierwille-adulation was/is so thick......few ever come forward with any information.

Another side note to this discussion.... Before Leonard, before 1953.....wierwille was a small-time preacher in van wert, ohio. From Leonard: 1) Wierwille stole the foundational material that catapulted his "ministry." 2) Wierwille copied the class-based system that Leonard utilized. 3) Wierwille tiered this system with additional classes of interest. 4) Wierwille kept the same 'Johnie-Jumpup, Maggie Muggins' characters as well. 5) Wierwille's collaterals used American Christian Press....Leonard had Canadian Christian Press. 6) Wierwille had found a pyramid scheme that propelled him to "The Teacher."

A nice generic term......"power for abundant living" for one and all. One step further....."biblical research" as defined by "what the word says." Then, later....vpw is the one who defines "the word." Then, later.......vpw indoctrinates his corps to define "the word." Jumping hoops and more hoops.....all in the name of "biblical research" and an "absent Christ" and a corps who follow in lockstep. Yet, the corps poem said something about..."not ruling with heavy hand believer's deeply springing powers." What's in a name? Just like today......on the 60th Anniversary of the People's Republic of China. People's Republic...??????? In China...??????

As most of us know here at GS......wierwille twice attended BG Leonard's class The Gifts of the Holy Spirit in 1953, in February and in June/July of that same year. This was no small commitment for an Ohio preacher who traveled to Calgary, Alberta Canada.....and on the second trip, with wife and son Don, two carloads of congregants. By October, wierwille taught this same material as his own......no syllabus, no class material. As the years passed, wierwille added some from Stiles, Kenyon, Bullinger and "law of believing jargon" to distance himself from others and copyright his material. What's in a name: Power for Abundant Living Hey.......you want POWER? And.......how about ABUNDANCE? And.......add some LIVING for good measure? C'mon folks......it's easy. Just pray, believe and presto......God will give you what you want!!! You get "abundance" in this life..........and REWARDS FOR ALL ETERNITY as you stay faithful to twi. Now, if you don't understand all the "keys" at first.....get into the next class nearest you and perfect your believing. See you at the rock and see you at the top !!! :B)

THE POWER OF THE INTERNET..... Ten years ago, starting in April 1999.....P@aul Allxn rocked the foundation of twi when he exposed twi's underbelly via the internet site, Waydale. Within months, the website had gained vast support as more evidence was uncovered. And, to be expected....a lawsuit ensued, depositions were gathered, and twi deemed it best to settle out of court for an undisclosed amount. Martindale was ousted from power. In similar fashion.........Andrew Breitb@art is rocking the foundation of acorn and its underbelly as shown via the internet site, biggovernment.com. In some ways, it seems like deja vu for some of us who witnessed the early days of waydale. And, what will happen next.......as a lawsuit is launched, evidence mounts, and the internet website is the leading voice. And, when all is said and done, how many will be ousted from power? biggovernment

Advanced Class attendees got a fair dose of this antisemitic/holocaust denial stuff as well. Even those hq kids were forbidden to attend the Holocaust Museum in Washington DC. Twi's propaganda reached far and wide.......regardless of going corps or not.

And lest we forget.....WIERWILLE was a subscriber to the Liberty Lobby and indoctrinated his captive audience (corps) with these views. Liberty Lobby

I agree with Linda on this. March 1985........The Word Over the World Auditorium opened. A few weeks later, vpw taught his last teaching at the auditorium on "The Hope." May 1985..........Wierwille died on May 20, 1985 In the months to follow (1985).....then-current trustees renamed it Victor Paul Wierwille Word Over the World Auditorium. In 1996 (?).......after martindale, with support from J. Reynolds the International Outreach Coordinator, declared "the word was over the world"......then the auditorium had to go thru another name change, thus Victor Paul Wierwille Prevailing Word Auditorium.

The direction of this is to an ebay audience.......therefore, it seems that a generic term "world recruiters" was used to reference twi's programs WOW/Way Disciples. In 1982.....twi was aggressively trying to send out 4,000 WOWs for the 40th Anniversary year. It was one of wierwille's "call to arms." The number was not reached....otherwise, twi would have blown the triumphant horns on this. Yeah, 3,100 sounds about right. In 1997.....43 Way Disciples sounds about right as well. I don't think this is "looney".....it has more to do with an ebay audience vs an in-house audience. <_<

Thanks Linda. Uuuugh.......in connecting these two letters from wierwille, it just shows the deceptive tactics that wierwille employed all along. Yes, I am NOW firmly in the camp that wierwille was a false teacher FROM DAY ONE...!!!!!!!