skyrider

Broken Arrow.....yeah, I know its all speculation. Things could have been worse, alot worse or A PATH OF LIFE, LOVE, GOD AND FULFILLMENT FAR GREATER. All my siblings have enjoyed lives full of kids, church, community, family-gatherings, college friends and experiences, and some have grandchildren in the mix. No dysfunctional families.....no drugs or prison terms. The only time I ever considered suicide was when I was IN twi......and several corps told me that they had to fight off those "suicide spirits" too.

T-Bone hit on something that I've been thinking about for YEARS. I know, I know......looking back is all speculation, but it certainly has its share of what-ifs?, regrets, deep-soul searching, and pondering the roads NOT taken. One of my deepest regrets centers around my family. My Dad died a couple of years ago....and the sting of his death still hurts. And, although my Mom is still living, I can't help but ponder HOW DIFFERENT LIFE WOULD HAVE BEEN had I not taken twi's detour. All the weddings, births, funerals, holidays, family-gatherings, memories, graduations, sporting events, etc.....that I missed during my twi tenure. Nieces and nephews that I hardly knew, grew up and graduated from high school. Now, some of them are raising little kids of their own. My siblings......ALL SUCCESSFUL, all own their own homes (no mortgages), all are situated quite well as retirement approaches. And, all four of them never took pfal....gasp!! Twenty years removed from their lives......before growing back together, beginning in 1998. Years of separation and me smugly thinking I was so much better than them. May God forgive me. College? Nope, I quit to go WOW....because that's what twi said was spiritually best. So, again, I lost contact with many college buddies. Thankfully, I've made great strides in the past dozen years......but I gotta say, it sure makes one wonder about THE ROADS NOT TAKEN.

Just a point to help clarify..... Two Family Corps men, Tom K. and Al G., were assigned to this project. Not sure how much wierwille added to this project, but these men were highly talented with extensive backgrounds in hydraulics, welding, engineering, etc. Officially named the Sno-way........similar to a small snowcat [click here] Don't really remember the final outcome, but think it was unacceptable. Others might know more.

Besides having a personal bodyguard with evasive-driver training, trained guard dogs, private security force, an inner circle of yes-men, and a loyal following of committed corps..... ......wierwille had a Family Corps guy (1981,82), a military vet trained in munitions, do a thorough inspection under the roa main stage checking for bomb explosives. I'm dead serious........(no pun intended)

Yeah......and now, my BS-meter can detect the trappings alot sooner.

WW.......very few have ever exposed wierwille's hypocrisy more than you. Thanks.

By 1981....Qui11en was no longer twi's "police chief"......L1nder or R0we stepped up. Yeah, maybe Charlie went to Illinois for a field assignment or something, but no longer staff. By 1981....Rev. M1ke Sm1th, 1st Corps, told me that he was ready to leave twi, but conceded to staying until after Living Victoriously (1982). By 1978....Rev. J0hn Clay, 4th Corps & Limb Coordinator, left twi. I'm only pointing this stuff out, because many seem to think that martindale screwed everything up......or, that Geer's POP paper was what woke people up. Silly me.....I stuck around, because I thought that by staying I'd be able to help turn things around. Sadly, the whole thing was far more corrupted than I ever imagined.

waysider.....yeah, I see your point. Thanks. In looking at this "top ten list of doctrinal errors"......one is left with the impression that martindale totally screwed up twi. Yet, twi was unraveling under wierwille's watch! And, many would contend that wierwille's credentials and life disqualified him from any and all spiritual oversight. How many of those corps/clergy types who left twi....AND WENT TO OFFSHOOTS.....still feed and seed the wierwille fallacy? Hundreds of these corps and clergy are still out there living off the legacy of wierwille. Classes with 12 sessions. Programs like SOWERS. The youth are sacrificed at the altar of wierwille's legacy once again. If I were to put forth a "top 10 list"......the countdown would look something like the following. And, "the law of believing" as purported in twi would be #1...the scriptures never state it as a law. Yes, God honors believing to those promises in the scriptures, but it isn't a wish list for self-advancement or gratification. Skyrider's Top Ten List of Doctrinal Errors 10) The Black Snowstorm was a Lie 9) Plagairism is Stealing 8) Take this class and shove it 7) The Way Tree has root fungus 6) Corps Program was Indoctrination 5) Members in Particular: Not collectivism 4) Twi was No Zion 3) MOG Doctrine is anti-Christ 2) Search the Scriptures: Not PFAL 1) The Law of Believing is a Hoax .

Research Geek NEVER gets to the root of the problems..... NEVER.....addresses all of wierwille's dark, deceptive ways..... NEVER.....addresses the plagairism, predation, perversions...... NEVER.....sees how lcm was two-fold the evil of wierwille....... NEVER.....considers twi's demise was happening in the 70s....... NEVER.....considers that wierwille 'might' have been a false teacher.... NEVER.....connects the dots as to why thousands were abused...... Perhaps, RG has learned some things since he wrote these articles.....and perhaps, he no longer is willing to give wierwille a "free pass" and all. BUT.....imo, this "top ten list" is trivial. I suppose with wierwille kids associated with CFF and all.....it's understandable why he'd see it this way. sarc/ Research Geek's Top Ten List of Doctrinal Errors #10 Genuine Spiritual Suspicion #9 The malpractice of Withdraw and Avoid #8 The Original Sin was Homosexuality #7 Owe no man anything #6 Weakness always brings down strength #5 All the corps becoming full time ministers #4 That agape love is FOR God not OF God #3 TWI is the true body of Christ #2 The Preoccupation with devil spirits #1 The Misuse of the Term "Present Truth" #0 The underLIEing that instigated them all

And again, I say......by 1978-1980, wierwille's TRUE COLORS were in full view. The Way International became the manifestation of a narcissist's world of control....a private "police force" patrolling twi-grounds, personal bodyguards and valets, private planes, motorcycles, motorcoach privacy, club house, guard dogs, young women, adoring crowds, abs slush fund, tax shelters, complicit accountants, speech/research writers, etc. Quite the gig if you can keep it going.....obviously, wierwille could not. Ch@rlie Qui11en......twi's "police chief" split J0hn R@ce............Ambassador One pilot left J1m Cr1mm............Personal bodyguard left po'd Others...............twi lawyer, mrs. w's assistant, etc. And......many thought it was a dynamic Christian movement.

WW.......thanks. The nature of man is one of rationalizing and justifying his sins.

The sinister side of me says this was far deeper..... What T-Bone said about his twig leader, I HEARD it as well. Think about that for a second. Not corps, not staffers at hq.......but little ole twig leaders who ALREADY were in lockstep with the mentality in the mid-70s. We used to scoff at those 'deprogrammers' who attempted to free many from twi, moonies, scientology, hari krishna groups, etc. Well...........maybe, we were PROGRAMMED. Was the renewed mind crap in twi ANOTHER PERVERSION of scriptural truth? Yes. And, pfal was the playground of mind-gymnastics. Remember in the DTA class where the devil's kingdom was represented by the scales of a crocodile, an impenetrable protection system? Twi was like that......twig leaders, adv class grads, wows, corps, staff, SCALES OF A CROCODILE. The corrupt system.....classes, programs, roa, mogs.....was layered with protection AND security systems. Watch patrol....aka 'bless patrol'..set a perimeter around the roa grounds to police itself. Bless patrol shifts at all corps campuses. Be watchful...ie devil spirits are everywhere!! How deep did the programming run......consciously AND unconsciously ?

Ironic, isn't it......a "bible class that teaches one the keys to researching the scriptures" and then, after you finish the course, your twig leader discourages it. No, no.....don't read Bullinger's "How to Enjoy the Bible" No, no.....don't go buy research books REPEAT CUSTOMERS AND FAWNING FOLLOWERS........is the name of the game.

BINGO..... Looking back at wierwille/twi......the message becomes clear. Question and Revolt......against your upbringing Question and Revolt.......against community involvement Question and Revolt.......against your churches Question and Revolt.......against society norms Question and Revolt.......against world & wealth Question and Revolt.......against TWI ???.......NEVER .

When one strips away all the adulation and twi-idolatry of wierwille......imo, he was a false teacher who succombed to the lusts of the flesh. With tongue in cheek......wierwille was "not anywhere near the top of the food chain." To add description to this analogy, let me say it like this.... Was he a killer whale?........no Was he a white shark?.........no Was he a marlin?..............no Was he a mackerel?............no He was a catfish, a bottom-feeder........yeah, he may have grown quite big in the back rivers of crawdads, minnows, and such, but a bottom-feeder nontheless. :)

Yes, the pfal/twi journey is a disturbing study of stealth and subversion. To me, it matters not whether wierwille set in motion a deliberate and malicious transformation of his followers.....he was an enabler all the same. In my experiences, I observed plenty of decisions, assignments, projects, confrontations, and blunders to realize that wierwille and co. were not anywhere near the top of the food chain. Your point on twi NOT a grassroots movement is well taken. Sometimes, I used to think that my first two years were "self-supporting" and all......but regrettably, realize that the messaging and marching orders were coming from afar.

No, twi didn't have anything to do with the Jesus Movement.....I didn't mean to imply that it did. Twi was like .0005% of the Jesus Movement....but don't quote me on that. Regarding church in the home.......my grandparents had an itinerant preacher who came thru their rural community in the late 20s - mid-30s and their home was utilized for these church meetings. So, if anyone thinks that wierwille was so "spiritual".......then, so were my grandparents.

Broken Arrow......thanks for your posts. Oh, how different everything was back in the late 60s and early 70s......the Jesus movement, the music, woodstock, the counter-revolution, the day the music died. The clashing of a cultural change was in the making. Then, while in college....I was invited to a "twig" off-campus. At that time, twigs were simple, short, spontaneously different, no corps or stuffy leaders......hahahaha. For two years, I hardly knew what a corps person did or looked like. Yet, with incremental steps.......the legalism put a stranglehold on twi. When all was said and done....it was FAR WORSE than church. And, crazy indoctrination......I stayed into the 90s.

The youth came out in great numbers in the 1970s. Was it a movement? Was it a pfal revolution? Was it a religious quest? Was it a revolt from society altogether? We no longer wanted to be shackled by our parents' religion. We gathered in numbers and took our movement to the streets. We waved the pfal-flag proudly in defiance of church tyranny. We demanded "freedom" to live and worship at twi's altar. We were there. We stayed up all hours of the night during roa festivals. We recruited others to strengthen our movement. We signed up for training -- collectively moving as a unit. Youth is a force of nature. Youth brings an energy and passion that is contagious. Youth can be single-minded and manipulated by powerful figures. Youth lives for the moment and is, at times, willing to die for the cause. The "liberation movement" led to decades of bondage. The "liberation movement" led to personal destruction. The "liberation movement" led to extreme elements of control. The "liberation movement" had secret and seductive agendas. TODAY......the movement is dead. TODAY......only those on payroll seem dedicated. TODAY......hardly anyone has ever heard of twi. Did it change the world? Did it change you?

The starter ingredient, the additive is.............leaven. Mar 8:15 And he [Jesus] charged them, saying, Take heed, beware of the leaven of the Pharisees, and [of] the leaven of Herod. The leavening in biblical times would have been far more limited that today's leaveners..... biological? chemical? mechanical? other? [click here].....but clearly, religious hierarchies and political systems use agendas and tactical advantage whenever possible. Imagine...... PFAL Wierwille, at age 51, knew the "hot buttons" and buzzwords to define and add distinction between his movement and the denominations. In pfal, he knew how to put down the churches and rebel against hierarchy....after all, wierwille was "one of them." He added the leaven to ferment his teacher-image, stirred in some stories and topped it off with manifestation toppings. SIT The culmination of the pfal class was to manifest. Even though many...MANY...students had to be "coached" into speaking in tongues, it was real. Right? Just keep practicing. Go thru the alphabet. Stand in front of a mirror. You can do it. Corps Bake ingredients in this oven at 375 degrees for 2 years. Upon graduation, wierwille's "bread" will be served as "the bread of life" to all. Go forth.

T-Bone.....I hear you loud and clear. The "milk" I refer to in pfal......was those simple truths from the scriptures. In the simplicity of scriptures, there was milk. BUT......when stirred with additives, and poisons, and skewd perversions, its NO LONGER MILK.

.....what if he lied about hearing an audible voice from God? .....what if he lied about "teaching the word like it hadn't been known (blah, blah, blah) .....what if he lied and/or exaggerated his India itinerary to boast worldwide influence .....what did wierwille actually do that demonstrated God's power in the 70s/80s? .....what did wierwille actually do besides teach and re-hash other mens' works? .....what if wierwille co-opted the Jesus Movement and and de-railed peoples' lives? .....what if we should have never been on "the yellow brick road" in the first place?

Yeah....when they sense you want to RECLAIM YOUR LIFE, the fangs come out!!! No matter how many years....no matter what you've done.....if you walk out the door with your dignity intact, you might take others!!!

......forgot about that one. But seriously, this question intrigued me back in 1978/79.....when I saw wierwille, on corps nights, come down with a heavy hand on 4th and 6th corps grads. Why attack them publically? Why not just let them go quietly out the side door? Why do I need to hear this stuff......even if it were true? Did Christ air one's 'dirty laundry' to his disciples? My mind was jolted by this....and, had I looked deeper to pursue this line of thought, I'd have found the exit door years earlier. Why wouldn't wierwille let those corps leave with dignity? Why wouldn't he let them go? Did twi 'own rights' to the lives of the corps and clergy? What's going on here? Why am I thinking these thoughts? Why am I in the corps, anyways? For a few more weeks, these questions continued..... If spiritual training doesn't lead to freedom, but servitude in twi......is it REALLY 'the true way?' Do other corps have these thoughts to wrestle with? Guess my mind was fighting twi's INDOCTRINATION back in the '70s.....

The Lord commanded.......Let My People Go. The Lord God wanted His people free from the taskmaster, the burden and the bondage of the Egyptian Pharaoh. Free to serve, free to live.....for Him. After pfal, after WOW, after Corps......why won't twi 'let the people go' and serve the Lord? Why the manipulation? Why the coercion? Why the micro-management? Why the name-calling? Why did wierwille refuse to allow corps and clergy leave twi in dignity? Why after 3 decades some staffers still are stuck on dependence and a dead-end job? =================================================================================================== Exd 5:1 And afterward Moses and Aaron went in, and told Pharaoh, Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, Let my people go, that they may hold a feast unto me in the wilderness. Exd 7:16 And thou shalt say unto him, The LORD God of the Hebrews hath sent me unto thee, saying, Let my people go, that they may serve me in the wilderness: and, behold, hitherto thou wouldest not hear. Exd 8:1 And the LORD spake unto Moses, Go unto Pharaoh, and say unto him, Thus saith the LORD, Let my people go, that they may serve me. Exd 8:20 And the LORD said unto Moses, Rise up early in the morning, and stand before Pharaoh; lo, he cometh forth to the water; and say unto him, Thus saith the LORD, Let my people go, that they may serve me. Exd 8:21 Else, if thou wilt not let my people go, behold, I will send swarms [of flies] upon thee, and upon thy servants, and upon thy people, and into thy houses: and the houses of the Egyptians shall be full of swarms [of flies], and also the ground whereon they [are]. Exd 9:1 Then the LORD said unto Moses, Go in unto Pharaoh, and tell him, Thus saith the LORD God of the Hebrews, Let my people go, that they may serve me. Exd 9:13 And the LORD said unto Moses, Rise up early in the morning, and stand before Pharaoh, and say unto him, Thus saith the LORD God of the Hebrews, Let my people go, that they may serve me. Exd 10:3 And Moses and Aaron came in unto Pharaoh, and said unto him, Thus saith the LORD God of the Hebrews, How long wilt thou refuse to humble thyself before me? let my people go, that they may serve me. Exd 10:4 Else, if thou refuse to let my people go, behold, to morrow will I bring the locusts into thy coast: .