skyrider

"Hold the phone....you mean to tell me they made Donna Martindale the CEO?" ~~~~~ Are you asking.....or is this sarcasm? If not, then.....YES, they made Donna CEO. Found on link below:

"Btw - Skyrider: thanks for posting this new thread. Mike came over to the one I started and completely derailed it. I actually would like to discuss this current move by TWI." ~~~~~ Yep, Oldskool.....I wanted to post on your thread, but it was sidetracked by Mikeo. Hopefully, this thread can stay on track so we can discuss this topic.

When the 6th PLAF-iteration comes out......"The Teacher" will be a holographic-image of wierwille sitting behind his desk. That way.....it will not need to be updated whenever someone exits twi.

You mean like ANOTHER purge?

4. WAP Class Update (2004 ?). Three Amigos teach sections. Still has the lingering effects and questions of Craig Martindale's presidency and cover-up. ADD: One of the Amigos exited twi. Steve Longley. Not a good look when one of the "teachers" of the class to leave twi.

No matter how many times TWI attempts to dress-up their image, inwardly they are full of all uncleanness, hypocrisy and iniquity. Matthew 23:27,28 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness. Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity. https://www.theway.org/blog/power-for-abundant-living-today/ Another iteration of the PFAL class. No matter how many times TWI staff tries to collaborate efforts on foundational constructs and principles, they continue to fail. They are blinded by self-importance and a haughty spirit of pride that obstructs them from a spiritual relationship with the Lord. 1. Power for Abundant Living (1967). Wierwille plagiarized wholesale from B.G. Leonard (stolen class) 2. PFAL '77. Wierwille attempted to update this class in 1977 (failed) 3. Way of Abundance and Power Class (1996). Martindale's attempt. A class filled with sport analogies and jockstrap ego. (crash & burn) 4. WAP Class Update (2004 ?). Three Amigos teach sections. Still has the lingering effects and questions of Craig Martindale's presidency and cover-up. 5. Power for Abundant Living Today (2022). Shiny and new. Makes it looks like twi is actually doing something rather than just serving refried teachings over and over again. Notice all the young frumpy staffers in the picture who worked on this class. Remind you of anyone? For twenty years, Greasespot Cafe has exposed wierwille's malignant narcissism, lies and deceptions. Standing at the podium, wierwille displayed talent in homiletics and swaying an audience. But when it came to his manner of life, faith, purpose, charity, purpose[ I Timothy 3:10 ] --- wierwille's message was hollow. He was a counterfeit. He was a false teacher. Even his speaking in tongues was ridiculously repetitive. Nor was he able to walk by those nine manifestations of the spirit that he touted in pfal. By grafting teachings, concepts and truths from genuine ministers thru the years, wierwille talked a good game.....but couldn't live it. Also, he had enablers and an inner circle of yes-men to amplify his every action and quell dissent. That's what mystified the youth for so many years. We were railroaded into believing this echo chamber and wierwille-mystique. All of our critical thinking skills were short circuited and groupthink was twi's "renewed mind" status quo. The heavy-handed centralized messaging and control is unmistakable. The bureaucratic machinery at headquarters is attempting, once again, to keep people involved (sending in ABS) and from asking too many questions. Activity is the name of the game. Keep 'em busy going to classes. After all, going to classes and supporting classes is "moving the Word" in twi's lexicon. The outreach on the field is DEAD. Whole states might have two or three twigs......if that. Stagnant religious ritual has replaced any youthful vitality that was once there. Field corps have been exiting for over 40+ years. Twi funnels the vast majority of abs-monies to hq and will NOT support limbs. If salaries and wages are given, it's meager at best. The pyramid scam will only support those in the uppermost seats. Does CEO Donna Martindale expect this new class be a catalyst for outreach going forward? Doubtful. But then.....twi doesn't really need a groundswell of growth and outreach to keep their non-profit status intact. $68 Million is a lot of walk-around-money for the grifters who are served by the underlings. They just need the activity to *appear* consistent with them being able to dip into the kitty of that non-profit facade to keep in good standing with the IRS. LOL This new class hits all the right buttons......1) Adds new buzz in twi, 2) Puts Craig Martindale further in the rear-view mirror, 3) Shines up the whited sepulchre again, 4) Keeps the staff and plebeians busy, and now 5) Donna, Rosalie and Marcia can slip away for fine dining and shopping. Aww....it's good to be Queen.

Some of us, here at GSC......have been proactively searching, analyzing and unraveling the twi-deception for over 20 years. Through the years, posters (mostly corps) have brought forth significant information of past situations and events that have been silenced in cover-up tactics. Thus, it is understandable how later corps and advanced class grads who became involved after 1978 were unaware of the depth and depravity of wierwille and his enablers. The top-down power structure in twi quickly amassed more power and control after 1972. Vague --- the corps program was an allegiance to wierwille. Under the guise of vague terms and commitments, the corps program was billed as training those with natural leadership abilities for "a lifetime of Christian service." There was a mystique of a "secret society" training for the spiritual elite.....few corps grads would divulge the ins-and-outs of their corps training. Vows of silence. Lock box secrets. Opaque --- many came to understand glimpses of *the way international* from reading Elena Whiteside's book The Way: Living in Love. Highly sanitized and sophomoric in content, very little transparency (opaque) was gained by a sycophant reading of this book. Classes, programs, history, finances, etc.... were deliberately opaque. If one probed to ask more questions, then he was soon confronted and targeted for being untrusting, a dissident. Incremental --- perhaps, one could dismiss wierwille's ministry as a rumbling, bumbling, back-woods organization that was overwhelmed with rapid growth. But when incremental patterns form consistently to advance power and growth......one sees that this "power highway" ONLY GOES IN ONE DIRECTION..... centralizing authoritarian control. Individual independence recedes and dependency on twi for direction and guidance in life ascends. Note: "Christ in you" teachings were rarely taught or emphasized (by 1978).....twi had become the *mediator* between you and God to pacify one's guilt and condemnation of sin. Just stay faithful to going to twig and you, indeed, are in "good standing with God." Sleight-of-hand.....in plain sight. Encroaching ---without the corps program, wierwille would have been unable to implement his narcissistic agenda of lusts and power. And further, when the 6th Corps sign-ups had crossed beyond 300....the trustees scrambled to find a campus. No way could headquarters house, feed and train this surge of growth. The college of Emporia was empty and on the market for sale. Thus, the 6th corps went in-rez at Emporia. Parents and families, too, wanted to be "trained".....so Family Corps were in training at Rome City, Indiana. Nothing amplified wierwille's power and control throughout twi more than the corps program. It contained all the elements of a cult subculture: 1) isolation, 2) levels of allegiance, 3) pecking order, 4) allegiance to the "man of God," 5) secret teachings and status, 6) two-tier system of spirituality, 7) and wierwille relished in adding fuel to this burning fire. Encroachment flourished. Accusing --- the pyramid structure in twi was absolute. No one held wierwille to account. He ruled by manipulation, intimidation and fear. His judgments were never over-ruled. Whether it was his failure over the first corps program (of which, he deflected blame and labeled it "the zero corps).... or his failure to produce an updated pfal class (PFAL '77). His enablers and inner circle would obfuscate the failures/details and keep the wierwille-mystique alive. The corps were to blame, at times, for some of his failings or "prophecies." All those Camp Gunnison prophecies of a unique western-style restaurant on the hillside, retirement cabins and center for elder corps, a dynamic summer-fun family camps, etc. .... fell to the wayside because the corps didn't believe. When more corps began exiting by 1977 and 1978, wierwille started sending out his personal corps letters to the corps household. He opined that corps were leaving him....... accusing corps of forsaking him. Purging --- looking back, I see that purging the ranks has ALWAYS been one of wierwille's hallmark traits. Narcissists, like petty tyrants...... cannot allow dissent to build. From 1957-1972, vpw struggled to pay the bills and build a following. So, when Perez, Heefner, Doop, and others were having great success, it threatened his (vpw's) backwater teachings at the brc. The youth movements DID NOT NEED WIERWILLE.... life and the power of God were moving mightily without him. Thus, the little narcissist did the thing that authoritarians do. He purged the "rogue leaders" and set the channels of leadership into the hands of establishment control: his corps leaders. Then, the vows of silence (cover-up) were issued. Move on. No talking about this power-grab and purge. Same thing happened with the three 8th corps who did "rogue research" in 1978. Wierwille had them purged from the corps. Wierwille fumed about this for months. Those who were on the research team like Charlene witnessed the core deception that twi didn't really do biblical research. In fact, there were several others who were purged thru the years from the research department. See the pattern? It is easily documented that wierwille/twi has been purging leaders since 1969 or so. Also, in the isolated confines of corps campuses and motor coaches, wierwille could PURGE ANY CORPS GIRL who refused his sexual predation and label her "possessed." Cult leaders hold absolute power of purging the ranks whenever they cross his agenda. Long-standing staffers were systematically purged from headquarters ..... and faithful twig coordinators on the field were purged from their positions and replaced with corps-trained sycophants. These purges significantly changed the *old ways* with an aggressive, lockstep agenda. The gentle, God-loving staffers were strategically replaced with the young, brown shirt-loyalists. Many saw the signs and headed for the exit doors (1977-1980). Harry Wierwille died in October 1977. No longer did wierwille have his older brother around to look over his shoulder. Some have indicated on GSC that this, too, allowed wierwille to be unleashed. His narcissism, mixed with sexual predation, was racing against the clock. Wierwille was 60 years old and all those years of heavy drinking were taking its toll. Martindale, too, implemented a series of purges from 1992-2000..... each and every purge added to the fear and frenzied atmosphere at the time. And, many splinter groups went thru iterations of purging others. In fact, CES/STFI was notably altered during their "Momentus" push to cycle people thru that extreme guilt/confession/isolation that targeted and destroyed lives. If it's vague, opaque, incremental, encroaching, accusing, purging....it's probably bad. WE WITHDREW OUR CONSENT. WE EXITED TWI. .

"Sky it’s funny I was thinking about this and our training. We were trained product salesmen, no different than traveling around hucking vacuum cleaners or encyclopedias. The parts of our training that helped instill any kind of discipline in me I am thankful for. Of course the overall arching idea of being groomed as a pawn for a selfish hedonists pleasures is the part that is the most difficult to acknowledge for many, some would prefer a seared conscience and false narrative. That part makes me sick." ********************************* chockfull.......I, too, have given lots of thought about our corps training. From what I remember, the corps application form was two or three generic paragraphs detailing the need to be a better leader to equip the corps for "a lifetime of Christian service." Standard verses were included, italicized and emphasized, to add Christian veneer to the program. But in reality, we were signing over our rights and privileges as individuals and to bow allegiance to the collective assortment of "teachers" and strangers.....er, fellow corps peers in deference to their "spiritual acumen." What did I know, or research, about wierwille's ability to administer and oversee a training program of young adults? Nothing. Having left college to go WOW Ambassador, I simply took the hype and encouragement of a 6th corps grad as a basis of my decision. In this idealistic frame of mind, I had surrendered my reasoning and logic to my "spiritual betters"........to enter an indoctrination program that led to years of cult-subordination, subjugation and self-denial. For me, glimpses of twi's untoward secrecy appeared when wierwille castigated corps grads during corps meetings in 1978 for abandoning him/twi. These were NOT the in-residence corps in "training," but corps grads on the field who, after years of involvement, were refusing ongoing leadership assignments to adapt to their new goals, decisions and career paths. Why the vehement anger from wierwille? My mind still held aspects of my college courses in Business Administration, management and marketing.....asking myself, "What right does wierwille have to demand ANYTHING from these corps grads? They were no longer in the training program, right? They were "out on their own" with a future stretching out before them. I held these thoughts to myself.....but, my thoughts and reasoning were still grounded in the reality that each person has the right to determine his'/her goals and destiny. Holding to these thoughts, I spent time searching the Scriptures to see if my reasoning was sound. I found dozens of accounts in the Gospels and Epistles that supported personal prayer, meditation and individual accountability. No one in twi would dispute that, right? This collective effort to "move the Word" has boundaries and limits that doesn't (or shouldn't) interfere with one's heart and personal relationship with God the Father, right? I came into the corps program as an individual......why would I not be an individual, with individualistic goals when I graduated? Further, it was clear that there was one mediator between God and man..... and it wasn't wierwille or the way ministry. Perhaps, this battle of personal boundaries and goals versus the altruistic, collective demand is not just in the fabric of cults, but in religion itself. Perhaps, it is ever-present in a larger world. But for me.....I found that wierwille's programs, and The Way International itself, treated me like property, like an indentured servant. Did this corps "contract" bind me to work, serve and sacrifice to them for the rest of my life? No. Hell no! But THAT is what they expected and demanded. Year after year, I was expected to be assigned to "go forth in areas of concern, interest and need." Who's concern? Theirs. Who's interest? Theirs. Who's need? Theirs. This was a manipulation of one's consent. Wierwille had devised a program that intimidated our youthful desires and indoctrinated our love for God to vows of a life of twi-servitude. Some saw the red flags early on and exited. Others took years to dismantle this indoctrination and define the proper personal boundaries for themselves against this cult's encroachment or holdings. Some have gone to their grave self-sacrificing never to unravel the mysticism of their overlords. After the "fog years"..... there was a freshness, a surge of simplicity and respect. Could it be that we had been measuring worth and commitment under the auspices of wierwillism? Perhaps, now..... Craig, Don and Howard will reflect on the systematizing of errors, the ludicrous loyalty oath, and hoist a new flag of "member in particular in the One Body of Christ?" Could we possibly in 1989/1990 be on the threshold of revival and restoration in God's Name? · For by one spirit we are baptized into one body [ I Cor. 12: 13 ] · Now God has set the members, every one, as it has pleased Him. Just when I'd accepted a new assignment as Oklahoma Limb Coordinator in August 1992 .......... I began to see the entrenchment of the old ways of wierwille's system resurface again. Each year to follow, the mass formation collectivism in twi grew in direct proportion to martindale's ego, a jockstrap mentality of "us versus them." Thankfully, I was 900 miles away and this distance provided a barrier, for awhile, of this centralized encroachment (again). But for all of us who know twi's failings, each year from 1992 onward escalated its cultish approach across every boundary line......personal, marriage, family, career. Anything that detracted from twi's agenda of control was targeted. Twi was indeed anti-family, anti-career, anti-Christian. One of the most effective weapons in their arsenal was *The Purge.* If you didn't attend the "new" advanced class, then you would be PURGED from the roster of advanced class grads. Unproductive people were purged. Even spiritual suspicion was relegated to a manifestation of the spirit. Homo purge. If you were known to be listening to old wineskin tapes and music from the "cop-outs"..... then you would be effectively be put on probation with the threat of being purged from the twi-household. The overlords spoke it into being.......and thus, obedience to the collective was mandated and mandatory, or else. The mission of "Word over the World" was updated to "The Prevailing Word." Mission creep. Every standard was upgraded. History of errors that got us to this point were negated. New themes were pronounced from central headquarters and needed to be followed without critical thought or dissent. Incremental steps of compliance. Incremental steps of control. What the twi-bureaucracy took away, they never gave back. Enough compliance was never enough. Then, in 1995.....the Granddaddy Purge of all, "All Corps Mandated to Full-Time Service." Twi needs you as a full-time minister in this prevailing decade of service. Rev. Martindale received revelation from God, doncha know? If you do not commit, then you are no longer a corps graduate. That signed diploma doesn't mean squat.....get it? Now, jump! All committed corps need to sign on the line. No, no..... you don't need to ask a thousand questions, we've got it covered. We'll put you on payroll and take care of your needs. Promise. Expect great things. God is behind this. We are going to see this prevailing word move like never before. Yes, I've written all this in my story "Insanity on Steroids." And yet, I see the same incremental and encroachment steps from wierwille's past (1957-1982) and rivenbark's encroachment (2000-2017)..... and incremental encroachment in the world at large. These truisms are found everywhere there are lords, tyrants, dictators and narcissists. Individual responsibility and personal boundaries are fundamental to freedom from cults and splinter groups. How many times does one need to be re-taught fundamental truths while sending tithes and offerings to church/cult leaders who pontificate mandates from on high when ascertaining scriptures is readily available? If it's vague, opaque, incremental, encroaching, accusing, purging....it's probably bad. Thanks for reading. .

And....it was worse than THAT. Many of us corps were assigned every 3 or 4 years to move to another state. From our meager bank accounts, we paid for the U-hauls, the upfront deposits, moving expenses and any incurred storage fees. Upon arrival, we found grads who were hurt and withdrawn as a result of bullying by the departing corps "leader." So, we rolled up our sleeves and toiled to regain their trust, respect and commitment to standards of moral and spiritual integrity. These gains were achieved by perseverance. Acquiring suitable secular employment was no easy task in a new state. Oftentimes, we didn't have references or recommendations to ease the transition. Needing to "hit the ground running," we had little time to find good secular employment so we'd settle for less....with the prospect of more. Is there any wonder why many corps moved in the circles of self-employment.....painting, landscaping, roofing, window cleaning, commissioned salesperson, etc..... when wierwille demanded ALL CORPS attend Corps Week and ROA each year? These directives exponentially burdened the corps. With each passing year, the central mandates and burdens from hq mounted. Add babies, toddlers and bills to pay....Oh, My! It was not just the secular job, but all the responsibilities that we were expected to juggle in the circus act. Witnessing. Teaching. Running Classes. Paperwork. How could the trunk office staff be SO OBTUSE to this groundswell of abuse leveled at the field corps? No Region, Trunk or Corps Coordinator had the gonads to tell wierwille (or martindale) that field corps could not keep pace with his narcissistic demands. Yeah....those jackasses that strut the halls of the OSC Building are the administrative pencil-pushers and looters of the productive. While many of us went into worn-torn states, toiled 70-80 hour weeks and saw God's grace and power in action......the directors, with their greedy-beady eyes, stashed more cash into twi-coffers. Robbing the areas of their strength and ability to grow and prosper....rather than keeping 85% in the state to use for operating expenses, room, building, etc. [agreement that Jimmy Doop outlined with wierwille]. This centralized funneling of abundant sharing to headquarters has been plundering states and areas since its devious inception. If you ever want to grasp the magnitude of how destructive these cult mandates were to the corps, just look at the massive exodus of field branch, area and limb coordinators. THOSE are the men and women who toiled in the trenches to help others until they could no longer withstand the financial burdens, the plundering from hq in God's name, the bullying and spiritual abuse. Not the staffers at hq. Not the advanced class grads ensconced in good-paying secular employment. The field corps. That's why ruthless directors at HQ are clamoring to have these seasoned field leaders return .

Twi is not, nor ever was.....true Christianity. Wierwille set up a pyramid system to exploit the goodwill and self-sacrifice of youthful energy, ambition and labor. Through manipulation, intimidation and guilt..... twi elevated its loyalists as they climbed-the-ladder-to-spiritual-maturity: Becoming Corps Grads. In public teachings and presentations, wierwille hailed "his corps kids" having committed their lives to this twi-servitude..... er, lifetime of Christian service. Yet, in reality...... the corps were little more than exploited slaves.... stringing the chairs before meetings, smiling and ushering and collecting the abundant sharing, re-teaching pfal material in twigs, faithful to work at every rock of ages. Who at the top wouldn't want a system like this to continue indefinitely? We were the victims of our moral consent. We were victims of guilt. We obeyed and self-sacrificed against our better judgment. Year after year, with this pilgrimage to every rock of ages.... we were propping up wierwille's deceptive scam. Every rock of ages, every big meeting.... became a herd-fest! Moving masses of people from one teaching to the next was the "central-bureaucratic-plan." WTF Really? The boredom was monotony..... moving towards insanity, except that I don't think they wanted a DIFFERENT RESULT. Why would they? Doing the same thing over and over again was reaping adulation and money to twi's coffers $$$$$$$. Wierwille couldn't DO any more, because he DIDN'T HAVE any more to give. He was a man of homiletics and theatrical presentation.... not a man of godly action and production. His mind was limited to habit: serial plagiarism and standing before congregations. Throughout all those years on corps and staff, I never once saw wierwille do something that I'd categorize as receiving/operating word of knowledge, word of wisdom or discerning of spirits. On the contrary, I saw him deflect, stammer and fume when certain situations would arise. Cults are the bottom-feeders of religion......these "leaders" are deceivers, seducers, looters, parasites, grifters and weasel-opportunists. Teachings and methods are manipulated to present a dichotomy....."us verses them," black versus white, right versus wrong. When you strip away the "colorful" teachings....you see they were pinpointed to induce a set of fears. To me, there is no doubt that the directors would like seasoned way corps TO COME BACK and board the train of twi-servitude..... because it enriches them, THE LOOTERS WHO PROFIT FROM THE SELF-SACRIFICE OF GOOD PEOPLE, GOOD LEADERS. Corps and Advanced Class Grads who gave decades of ABS and labor to twi Trustees/Directors try to act "spiritual".....but are deadbeats and scumbags Wierwille was propped up for decades by serial plagiarism and enablers Some smart and savvy leaders saw thru vp's shtick early on..... and walked away Others gave years in twi-service..... to finally discover its deception and corruption Once unshackled from a cult... a bountiful harvest of life and love is restored That's why, to me....... NEVER allow yourself to be reattached to a splinter group!!! Those guys have been groomed for decades by wierwille/twi..... and STILL heap adulation onto wierwille and adapt all of his methods into their splinter groups. Two-fold the evil [Matt 23:15]. .

Seldom do I venture over into the Memoriam Thread......but I did today and saw that DMiller had passed away. Age 68 (too young). And further, there was only 1 reply to this announcement....to a guy who'd posted on this site 12,421 times. ~~~~~~~~~ So, in light of that.....I just wanted to say.... Thank you, posters..... for sharing your stories, interests and viewpoints here at GreaseSpot. Those who posted years ago, thank you!! Sometimes, I venture back into pages 140-185 to re-read some of those fascinating threads and debates. Certain posters that I knew in person.... I found/find it interesting to learn things from their area and viewpoint. What happened? Why people stayed? Why people left? Why people went back.....then left again? As some posters have shared thru the years......we view those that leave GSC as "success stories." This is a place of support, help, concern and forgiveness. Some accuse us of bitterness for confronting wierwille's twi with their deception, fraud and sins.....but, in truth, it is WE who are standing firm on truth, values and dignity. But for twi-leadership, past and present, that extended forgiveness must first be accompanied with godly sorrow to repentance....before forgiveness grants one a refreshing confidence (II Cor. 7:8-16). So, until Paw wants to close shop here or pass the responsibilities onto someone else.....looks like the 'Spot will continue to support the weary of heart. So, faithful posters.....thanks!! If I drop off the radar and you read my obituary in the near future (hopefully, years from now)......I just wanted to cover my thanksgiving bases and let you know I appreciate all your support. And, if it's not too much trouble.....maybe a few of you guys could get a quartet together and sing at my funeral. Thanks. .

Perhaps, I was a recalcitrant recruit when I went in-residence corps in 1978.......I should not have gone corps. Within six weeks of this "training program"..... my inner conscience was skeptical of its methods. This certainly was deeply regimented compared to my college days..... not that I expected such freelance activity and bar hopping, per se. LOL. But geez, why were we rehashing thru the foundational pfal-stuff again? Dale Carnegie techniques to selling and motivate others? Retemories in your shirt pocket and be ready to recite a specific verse upon command.....in public? Generic health, fitness and well-being classes including menstrual cycles, ovulation and mucus method? Knowles breathing attendance in the wierwille library at 5:30am? Jet-style packing, really? Each twig and/or branch coordinator will require you to keep forms up-to-date. Floss charts. Aerobic points. Monthly budget report ($20 was maximum allowed to be spent each month). Writing your sponsors faithfully. Roll call attendance for all meetings when we weren't assigned to twig-assemble. Why all these FILLER classes and activities??? I guess that I thought going in-residence would be a step up from the advanced class, no? You know, all that emphasis on the revelation manifestations (word of knowledge, word of wisdom and discerning of spirits) AND the action manifestations (faith, miracles and healings). Maybe, I was just TOO IMPATIENT..... those teachings, and specifics, will be taught after we move thru the "walking to running" stages. Surely, there's going to be MORE than just this???? Nope.....there wasn't. Even when wierwille came to Emporia, I thought that we'd really see something special. Heck, "the man of God" was on campus for several days and his motor coach was parked behind Wierwille Library. He's well rested and well served at the lunch head table. Anything that he summoned was delivered to him promptly. He's been show double-honor with every protocol......so, tonight we are going to see ACTION, can't wait. And then, another tepid teaching. Ugh. The times when wierwille became most highly animated and angered were when confrontations were dished out to dissenting corps. Wierwille snuffed out questioning dissent in his corps program.......and the dissenter. Good people, good leaders walk away......because THIS was not education, THIS was indoctrination. THIS was not excellence in Christian education......THIS was vile indoctrination. .

Yep, "madness" to do that stuff in corps training......for sure. BUT also......it was "madness" to slander (i.e. character assassinations) leaders who were running back-to-back classes. Where was the outpouring of joy and excitement for peoples' deliverance from the devil's kingdom? Where was the support and thankfulness shown to those who were serving and ministering on the streets of hardened cities? Where were the testimonials.....bringing these leaders into hq to teach the 2nd and 3rd corps to give the best training and expertise possible? Why would wierwille "take a dagger" to these men's work and energized ministries? How incredibly short-sighted, selfish and narcissistic one must be to have such tunnel-vision? So, it really wasn't about "moving the word over the world" ...... it WAS ABOUT consolidating the power, control and money at wierwille's fingertips. How did that work out, mister wierwille? Sure, power-grabbing the movements of Perez, Doop, Heefner, etc. brought money into the coffers at hq..... and maybe, a groundswell of young folk were duped into going into the corps (1976-1986)......And???? And then what? Selling off 4 corps campuses years later.....at reduced prices. Pathetic, anemic signups for classes and corps.....for decades. Plus, a hollowed-out empty echo chambered auditorium at headquarters.....er, DEADquarters....ppfffttt. Go ahead, eat your dollar bills with soup and crackers. Surely, wierwille would embrace and honor scripture over selfish agendas, wouldn't he? What about his legacy? Oh, that's right...... wierwille had no concept that an internet would arrive on the scene and expose all his secrets and "good name." A good name is rather to be chosen than great riches, and loving favour rather than silver and gold. Proverbs 22:1 A good name is better than precious ointment, and the day of death than the day of one's birth. Ecclesiastes 7:1 .

GOOD PEOPLE, GOOD LEADERS WALK AWAY. More later………. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The scriptures warn us of evil men, seducers, deceivers, taskmasters, etc......those who desire to ensnare us. Whether it be Pharisees or Pharaohs, the truth is plain to see: BEWARE and REBUKE. The first usage of this word "snare" is seen in......Exodus 10:7 And Pharaoh's servants said unto him, How long shall this man be a snare unto us? let the men go, that they may serve the LORD their God. Recognizing an unholy alliance and/or covenant towards man's authority is the first step towards freedom. Down thru the ages, even to this day.....evil, arrogant aspirations of men and organizations are around every corner to entice and subjugate. Most every organization and/or movement targets the youth. They are the most vulnerable. Young minds are malleable.....and once groomed to discipleship, they provide decades of value (return on investment). Deception is key and thus, there seems to be an intermediary (a groomed peer) placed in a position to "run the ruse." The deceiver is stealthily hidden from view. More often than not....down thru the years, way corps were the groomed intermediaries sent out to ensnare others into the corps, into subjugation. We were consistently taught (especially behind closed doors in the corps program).......that those who left were "cop outs." I REJECT THAT PREMISE. What's to say that THOSE who walked away from wierwille's corps-subjugation program were the strong ones, mighty for the Lord, valiant for the TRUTH? Perez, Heefner, Doop, Somerville, etc......these were the ones seeing the power of the Lord in manifestation. On the streets healing drug addicts, turning hearts to the Lord. Signs. Miracles. Wonders. That's what was happening in the early 70s.......TRUE REVIVAL. Yes, they were running back-to-back classes, but I contend that it was merely a small framework of the dynamic outreach!! Walking in His presence. Ever-mindful of His spirit. Full-rejoicing in His glorious power to saints and sinners alike in the most precious name of our lord and savior Jesus Christ. The true revival was spearheaded by humble men of sinful nature who stood tall in His mercy and grace!!! Wierwille, time and again......thwarted energized ministries and co-opted individuals for his own selfish purposes. If there was any value to a structured learning environment like the corps program......it could have (should have) been like 3-4 months long, tops! No more. Crap, if you can't teach energized people these truths in 4 months......then, you're a counterfeit. Wierwille was a subjugating counterfeit..... claiming to be some "great one" (read: Acts 8 -- Simon the sorcerer). All that gobbledygook of twi being "the true household, the true remnant"......is junk bible talk. Down thru the ages, the true remnant are those who cleave to the truths of John 15:1-8.......I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman. (etc.) Good people, good leaders have been walking away from twi since wierwille's days in Van Wert. The church board voted unanimously to have his name stricken from the clergy register......and they were absolutely right in doing so. .

GOOD PEOPLE, GOOD LEADERS WALK AWAY More to come ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Time and again, we hear the GSC-accounts of good leaders walking away from twi. With documented evidence, it certainly raises the issue, "What would have happened in twi and around the country if these good men and women wouldn't have been driven away?" Another insightful post by DWBH: john som---ille has a phd in physical education......he has been married to mary wie===lle for over 30 years now.......he is a high ranking officer in the usmc reserves, (if he is not yet retired from the reserves).......he was an assistant to woody hayes at ohio state university when woody was the head football coach there......his brother tim and john started the way's "work" in north carolina at ecu.......john is a viet nam veteran......vic used to tell us that john volunteered for duty in viet nam in order to prove that the revelation and power manifestations are real and work as vic taught them to wayfers in the advanced class.....john is a decorated officer for his outstanding military service in viet nam, as well as numerous other outstanding achievements in the marine corps......he has also worked in an advisory capacity with the idf.....israeli defense forces....in israel.....work for which he was recognized again by the u.s. military, as well as the idf.......i first met john in 1972 when several of us way east branch coordinators were invited to hq by vic after the firing of steve heefner during the ac in rye, ny in april of 72...........to see vic's "heart" and the "heart of the ministry" so's we would stick with twi and not "run off" with heefner and others after the "not so subtle" power play by twi in it's complete takeover of the way east..........at that time, john was in charge of "college outreach" for twi and was the man who designed the physical trainng program that was part of the corps training back then...........he was definitely a "man's man" during the entire time that i knew him back then.......absolutely respected by us corps "kids" and, generally respected throughout the ministry as far as i could tell............he also coordinated twi's original holy land tours.......and led several of them with great success and excitement back in the early 70's.........my personal experiences with john were always positive and i held in him in high regard, as i do to this day....although my last personal contact with him was back in the late 70's...... john was his own man.......during my first year in da corps (the way corps, that is)....we took his class on old testament history.....which was excellent btw......and i began to see the first glimpses of his conflict with vic..........glimpses that became less and less private as that year unfolded..........he had a "knack" for really pizzing vic off with his unflinching honesty and "sarcastic" humor in the face of some really intense "facemeltings" directed at him by vic, both pubicly and privately!!.........vic would criticize john publicly about something he would teach or say during the old t class, and john would throw it right back at vic.......it was great to observe!!!!..........vic often publicly ranted about john's "ego problem" with vic..........and i mean rant!!.....you know, that purple-faced, neck-vein popping kinda rant that only vic could perform!!.........made the dancing prez look like a mickey mouse version of ranting!!..........my take on these rants??.......vic was deeply jealous of john's obvious intelligence and the real achievements of john academically, as a true military "hero", and at his refusal to compromise his own integrity as a "man's man" in the face of the vicious verbal assaults and personal attacks from his father-in-law!!..........he was jealous of john because john was real, not just a pompous phoney like his father-in-law!.....vic feared john, because, in spite of vic's best shots, vic could not break his son-in-law!!...i had several profound, personal conversations with john about my observations of his relationship with vic.......honest, probing and quite revealing conversations for which i am still grateful today to john for engaging in with me......... in 1974, john left hq and set up the total fitness instiute (tfi) in north fork, ca with the financial assistance of j--n s. l--n and the "blessing" of vic..........tfi was to become the real testing and training ground for the way corps folks.........the experience which would really show vic who his toughest future leaders and workers would be..........it was also open to public sessions which were like twi's version of outward bound, and it rapidly gained a popularity among the corps and non-corps attendees as a real test of a believer's mettle when it came to operating all-9-all-the- time..........it was the precursor to LEAD, which was the vic perverted and controlled version of what john had in mind for tfi!.........it was during the tfi sessions of the spring of 1975 that vic first "ordered" john do the pow camp thingy...... i was on the field in my interim year corps assignment (we were the first corps to have one).......and my lc was one of the attendees at the tfi session where martindale and other "top" corps leaders were given the pow treatment..........they were exposed to the illuminati tapes by myron cohen, and the tapes on music by the marx fella, etc.......they were tied together at points, kept locked up in heavy cardboard boxes which were pounded on from the outside all night, sleep deprived, exposed to heavy-handed interrogation techniques, blaringly loud tapes and music, told that the usa had been invaded and taken over by the russians, and, that they would be broken from standing on the word.........it was a very real experience of what a pow camp might have been like if those circumstances regarding the fall of the usa had been true..........martindale was not the "only survivor" of this pow camp passionplay..........he started an "escape attempt" type of maneuver during which he caused the "deaths" of most of his fellow "prisoners" by his feeble attempt at being the hero/leader........a maneuver for which he was roundly criticized in his final tfi evaluation which was written by john som---ille on each of the participants..........there were several participants who were indeed "broken" during this experiment.......and their "reward" was humiliation in front of the corps and they were never really "trusted" again with choice leadership assignments because of their proven weakness in the face of the enemy!!!...........the participants were sworn to secrecy.....so that the pow experiments could continue unhindered during future tfi sessions..........but, as you can tell from the amount of info i gathered from my lc upon his return, the secret got out fast.........but the pow experiments continued through the tfi session of that spring and summer until october, 1975..........when there were some serious physical and psycho-emotional injuries that occurred during tfi...........all of which, vic blamed on the "total lack of believing" on the part of those "injured"............i did my tfi trip in november, 1975..........and although several of the pow situations were thrown at us.....the pow scenario itself had been watered down so as to avoid any further injuries......... the tfi experience for the in-rez corps involved the following "rules"..........each tfi group was to hitch-hike to and from north fork in "couples", that is, you chose your travelling partner from among the group........we were encouraged not to choose our spouses, but my spouse was under 20 at the time so i refused to let her go with anyone else..........each person was given a $20 bill so as not to get busted for vagrancy if stopped or questioned by state or local police while hitch-hiking.........it was made plain that if you did not arrive at north fork with the entire $20 you would be immediatley turned back to hitch-hike home.......or, if you made it back without the $20 intact you would receive a failing final evaluation.........you were allotted 72 hours maximum to make the trip each way.......if you took more than 72 hours to get there, you were again immediately turned back to hitch-hike home, refused participation in the tfi program......if you took more than 72 hours to get back home, you again were giving a failing final evaluation.........my wife and i were dropped off at a truck stop near I-75 and it's juncture with I-70 at about 6pm and we then had 72 hours to make our way to north fork, ca........by hook or by crook...........we made it in 70 hours.........no sleep, no stopping, both our $20 bills in pocket!!...........i remember how sad i felt for the unfortunate few who took longer than 72 hours to get there........i literally cried as i watched them turned around after their grueling trip out to ca, no food, no rest.......just a facemelting phone call from vic telling them they flunked and that they better make it home on time or they'd be kicked out of the corps!!..........i watched 6 people have to go through that bs!............ before i left for tfi, i was called to vic's office for a "meetring" with him.........we sat out on the porch by his office, smoking a couple of cigarrettes..........vic asked me to keep our conversation "confidential".........he said that he knew that i had become "close" to john som---ille, during my first year in-rez........he said he knew that i could "talk with john "man-to-man"..........he said that john's "unbridled ego" was going to ruin tfi.........he just was not "seeing" what father wanted vic to do with tfi.......he said john was once again "fighting him" (vic) on the "guidance" god was providing........and he asked me to try to talk with john about his "ego problem" with his father-in-law, hoping that maybe i could "get through to him"..............so, on a cliff overhanging the sierra nevada mountains, having just successfully scaled jackass rock, with only john and jack wilson with me (i had been "banned" from the group assault on jackass rock the day before for taking an "unauthorized picture" of two lindas relieving their bladders behind a log while we were all tied together by a single rope for the day's hike to the foot of jackass rock.........lol!).........while jack was busy preparing for the descent, i had my "man-to-man" talk with john..........one of the greatest conversations i ever had with any wayfer in my life, brutally honest, refreshingly quiet in tone with mutual respect........needless to say,.....i never really "got through" to john about his "ego problem" with his father-in-law!!..........by the end of my first question and his respnse, i saw there was absolutely no need for me to..........there was not a thing wrong with john's ego..........the problems were with the ego of his father-in-law!!!........... soooo,...........what's my point???...............the entire confrontation session you poor FLO folks had with that guy who probably lived in a van down by the olentangy river was just another perverted distortion of what had been a good idea of john som---ille's that was perverted, twisted, and morphed into another psychosocial torture mechanism designed by vic to break down and control the most willing and faithful followers of his way in ohio..........arranged by a lc who was as afraid of the whole thing as you were, but who was more afraid of what his "father-in-the-word" would do or say if he did'nt carry out his orders!!............i hope your "facilitator" was not bill m--ze.........but it very well could have been..........bill was a terrific dale carnegie isnstructor whom vic "took under his wing" and also eventually destroyed what started out as a unique and valuable service to the corps........bill was tied to vic all the way back to the chimes hour youth caravan daze........he was almost like an "adopted son" of vic's,.......and we all know too well what that can do to a man!............ sorry for the length of this post.......but the memories sometimes come in waves..........................peace. .

“Likely part of a cycle . . . perhaps the discard portion?” Rather than focusing on the narcissist again ……or the narcissistic cycle, I see a pattern that continues to emerge over and over again. GOOD PEOPLE, GOOD LEADERS WALK AWAY. More later……….

For years, I'd wondered why twi-history seemed to have this BLACKOUT of those 1970-1973 years Seemed like all the messaging was the corps training of those early corps. Very little was highlighted about what was happening on the field. What happened to all those early leaders? Why were SO MANY GOOD LEADERS LEAVING? Sure, I'd heard bits and pieces..... like Donnie Fugit in Kansas and the Way Home in North Carolina.....but NOT THIS. Now I see........there were rifts and infighting until wierwille sent the 2nd and 3rd corps into New York in 1973. And, the cover-up.....that followed.

Thanks chockfull......yes, it is enlightening to tie historical accounts of twi from a field perspective for others to see. Today's chumps who sit in twi's "directors" chairs are little more than glassy-eyed loyalists to the groupthink message of "...praise be to wierwille." DWBH post Your post reminded me of why in the hell I decided to go into the way corpse in the first place. It was right after the 2nd and 3rd corpses came into NY, on the first of what were to become known as “Lightbearers”......the in-Rez corpse “practical challenge” to prove the efficacy and reality of the corpse training in the the lives of “god’s most committed” followers of the way. That was in the late spring and early summer of 1973. It was the 2nd corpse (graduating that August) and the 3rd corpse (finishing up their first year in-Rez). Unlike the subsequent “practical challenges” of “Lightbearers” groups, which were primarily made up of getting a piffle class together within a two week visit to an area of “concern, interest, and need”, this group was sent out on the mission to kick foot, take names, and “straighten things out” in the limb of NY, which had been hit very hard by the putsch-like firing of Steve and Sandi Heefener in March of 1972, and the resistance to Boob and Doody Moneyhands having been brought in as the new limb bosses. I had been a “full-time ministry employee” at the way of Long Island from September 1971 through May, 1972. Steve and Laurie Perez were the full-time area leaders for the way of Long Island, which they started from scratch in the fall of 1970. There was an authentic Christian “revival” in lower NY among the young people and hippies of the time. Steve and Laurie sparked a non-stop slew of piffle film classes at a clip of 4 or 5 a month from Suffolk, Nassau & Queens, for 12 months in a row, leading up to the AC in Rye, NY in March, 1972, during which the Heefners were publically slandered and spitefully fired. When the Heefners got fired, the Perezs quit. That left Ed Goebel, John Petty, and me as the remaining full-timers down in lower NY from the 5 boroughs of the City to Nassau and Suffolk Counties. We all decided to quit full-time employment with the way of NY, but, except for Ed, we retained our oversized branches to keep running classes. At that time, the whole “blue form” send all the $$ to HQ thing began too! So, it had been quite a year of fighting and resisting for the lower NY areas by the time the 2nd and 3rd showed up in June of 1973. I was busy getting ready for the ROA ‘73 and finalizing my decision on whether or not to go into the corpse that fall. I got married in July of that year and 2 weeks later was at HQ for summer school and in-Rez. I was playing back- up guitar for Cliff, and lead guitar for Sweet Fellowship (most of whom were going into the 4th corpse) and we backed-up a whole bunch of other groups from the Northeast. Doug MacMullan was 3rd Corpse and he was specifically assigned to work with all us “way productions” people to get us ready for the ROA that year. It was total HELL! LOL! Rehearsals were these 14 hour marathons at Ray Bertine’s parents’ farm in upstate NY, with Mac Mullan telling us to smile, and move, and look at the audience, and, and, and, and........., It was during that week of rehearsals at the farm, that I made the decision to go into the corpse. My thoughts were these: I could see the handwriting on the subway walks pretty damn clearly! If anyone wanted to have any leadership position in the way it would eventually require doing time in da corpse! THAT was made quite obvious to us by vp himself during that month-long Advanced Class in Rye, and by Boob and Doody with their smarmy obsequious worship of all things dictor paul, and by the book bondage”leadership” style. I just wanted to get married, run the Queens/Brooklyn Area Of NY for the way, and make my living playing music. I did NOT want to go be a limp leader or staff person somewhere. I wanted to stay in NY, get married, play music, and “move da word”!! LOL! There’s the language manipulation again!! Well, once we were in the way corpse gulag at HQ, EVERYTHING CHANGED! VP had big plans for us Way Productions keedz that we had no idea about! Then, suddenly, there was an Interim year added!!! WTF?? And then......JCING came out.....and then PFAL ‘77.....and then AC ‘79......and then The 40th Anniversary Year weekends, Living Victoriously, The Installation of Da forehead on the 40th Anniversary, Sound Out ‘84.....WIBAP.......one mega event after another and no time to think about what the hell we were doing other than we were “just moving the word”!! Well that wound up a big bust! LOL! Point of it all being, I never went into the way corpse to be a lifelong ful-time “Minister”! I just wanted to get married, run a branch or two for the way of NY in the City, and play music. I only wanted the corpse so HQ would leave us alone in NY! Leave us alone to run classes, glorify Jesus, play music, have fun, and live life! But, dictor Paul had other ideas. He manipulated the meaning of “a lifetime of Christian service” into a lifetime of indentured servitude to his personal perverted peccadilloes and pathological illnesses. I pity the fool. .

"I wish I were the man I know to be." victor paul wierwille I wish......... I were........ I know....... Translation: I see myself (a projected image) on a glorious stage as a world-renowned leader knowing there are millions upon millions who crave to hear me teach. When I speak, the throngs of crowds before me listen with reverence silence.........to hear words of majestic importance for their lives. From their subservient demeanor, I am assured that the Lord has called me to this great endeavor, place and time. .

After reading thru this thread again........ Jim Doop, The Way West and VP There's a window of twi-history (1969-1972) before wierwille's establishment-men (yes-men) and way pyramid....er, tree were structured to funnel all power and money to headquarters..... that twi doesn't want people to see. WOW. Men like Perez, Heefner, Doop, and others on the frontlines of ministering to others and walking with the power of God. Touchstones to the Jesus Movement. Evolving into another Youth Movement. The Groovy Christians of Rye, New York. Excitement. Deliverance. Healing. The spirit of God opening doors. Notice: Who did wierwille bring in to run New York after ousting Heefner? Bobby Moneyhands. Yep, nearly 50 years ago..... slick-vic brings in "his guy" to replace all this back-to-back class activity with an establishment-guy. From all that we now know about wierwille....this all makes sense. Imagine....seeing all this 50 years ago, supporting (covering) wierwille and his sins, top-tier of clergy list, region guy, campus/ corps coordinator for years, etc. .... AND THEN, OUSTED WITH MARK & AVOID LABEL. Any thought about this cover-up, Bob Moneyhands? It seems to ALWAYS be the corps coordinators and assistants ...... who start up Splinter Cults. They are the drill sergeants of groupthink indoctrination and are locked into an echo chamber that they seem unable to escape. They persist on leading others in this quixotic journey of rigid conformism. When in truth.....they are the ones who are the beneficiaries of selling soap. They enjoy travel, leisure, flexibility, perks, payment, ease in retirement and adulation. Who could ask for anything more? This background and more, is why I think...............Splinter Cults are WORSE. .

Those big herd-fests from the mid-70s to early-80s never ceased......once twi had its power consolidated and its centralized-bureaucracy in place. No more itineraries for the traveling-mog. The Pompous...er, Prevailing Auditorium was the new, shiny object to behold. When things nose-dived after geer's poisoned, preposterous, pretentious proclamations......the centralized-focus from headquarters had to regroup (1986-1990). So, what happened? Baby steps. Small and friendly rock of ages.... Craig, Don and Howard were actually down-on-the-ground greeting and shaking hands with the corps and faithful followers. Emphasis on love and unity....building back what had been lost/stolen. Then, with each year......bigger meetings. Martindale was going to teach a LIVE advanced class at the Indiana Campus. All faithful corps and advanced class grads should (NEED) to attend. With nearly 80% of corps gone.....all eyes were on *Advanced Class Grads* to rise up and serve. Therefore, twi set in motion Advanced Class Specials (more herd-fests) to coerce.....er, strengthen efforts to move forward. It's the mass formation way to encourage, manipulate and coerce the herd to move into the corral to brand them. Even worse.....twi started doing Annual Advanced Class Specials in Dallas over Thanksgiving Weekend. Field corps labor was used to minimize operation expenses Twi utilized the long Thanksgiving weekend when many used "vacation time" Cult tactics.....to squeeze in there and keep "earthly families" apart Hotel cut rates.....because MOST people are WITH their OWN families during Thanksgiving As a corps grad in Oklahoma City, my wife and I were "invited" (assigned to work) to attend these Advanced Class Specials in 1995, 1996 and 1997. My responsibility was to be Mrs. Wierwille's escort. When we left twi in August 1998.....I even received another "invite letter" around October 1. LOL One of my comments that I posted years ago: Dallas, Again: When this letter arrived in the mail, I knew what it said....even before opening it. Once again, I was "invited" to attend the Advanced Class Special in Dallas, November 1996. And, again......be Mrs. Wierwille's escort. Well, I guess that I must have done a fair job, because no one else was assigned to it. That spoke volumes. My wife would, once again, be working in the green room. Another Thanksgiving weekend with the "cult family." It had been 20 years since I'd been home for Thanksgiving.....around my parents' table, eating a good home-cooked meal. Growing up in a hunting family......one year at Thanksgiving with aunts and uncles, we had turkey, duck, pheasant, goose and quail. Now, THAT was a wild game meal to behold. Most always during our family get-togethers, we'd head out the door around 7am and hunt pheasant for about three hours Thanksgiving morning. Then, we'd field-dress the birds and enjoy the fresh pheasant. Those days were long gone.......now I spent Thanksgiving dressed in a suit and my butt in a chair. I must have been insane....... .

For more back ground to Twinky's question......here's another interesting post from the Jim Doop thread: Posted by Tom: I thought there was still a Way East and a Way West at the time of the separation between Doop & Heefner, and The Way, but maybe VP incorporated The Way 1st & then kicked them out. I didn't think so. I wondered why Steve and Jim didn't just tell VP to kiss off at the time. There was no twi, no authoritarian hierarchical power structure, no Way Tree (VP had gotten the "revelation" as he called it, he had taught it, but it wasn't in place in NY or CA at the time), no centralized abundant sharing. Even if VP had done something legal turning the Way into a corporation (as I said, I think that came later - very soon later), it wouldn't have mattered. There was no question in anyone's mind about loyalty to VP, the man of God - in the WC, no doubt, but not on the field. Had Steve and Jim just kept up what they were doing, everyone would have just kept up what they were doing right along with them. I just don't get it. I know one of the things VP was complaining about was that he had no way of keeping track of the money. That was his stated point of contention with Heefner; VP said Steve was doing yada, yada, yada with the money. That summer (what we were told was that Steve was taking a sabbatical), Steve Perez (who God told to move to NY & told him the Word would move if he did - who started the ministry in LI) and Ed Goebel, his assistant, a couple of sharp fellows, put together a system whereby VP could track the ABS (the truly self-financing way we were doing it in NY at the time). They presented it to VP at summer school. I met them after they returned from meeting with VP. His response was that he was going to centralize the ABS. He said that it was only a temporary measure. He said that he knew the way that we were doing it was the right way to do it, but that the believers were too immature to handle the money properly. He said that, after the believers matured, we would return to the grassroots way of handling ABS - the Word's way. Wait a minute! Doesn't the Word say that if a man can't handle the mammon, that God is not going to entrust that man with the true spiritual riches? How then were all these signs, miracles, and wonders happening? How then did God entrust the believers with the hearts of so many that were turning on to the Word? Are they not the true spiritual riches that the same God said he would not entrust to people who could not handle the mammon? Pretty soon, the way we had been doing the ABS was no longer the RIGHT way; it was WRONG and DEVILISH, and you'd better not bring it up in a positive light, or YOU were spiritually compromised. BS. I wonder if the leaders weren't too impressed with the value of PFAL as a tool to move the Word. We were in the midst of over a year of running back to back film classes in LI. We were so young; I think the leadership wondered what to do with people once you witnessed to them without the class & materials. Should have told VP to kiss off. Ah well - easy for me to say. .

Thanks WordWolf......for hunting these links down. Jim Doop, The Way West and VP Posted by Sunesis: I see, looking back in hindsight, where VP, in order to be successful, hijacked two ministries. The first, was B.G. Leonard's - he stole his class, almost word for word, charts, etc. This class gave him a product to sell. The second, was his going to CA, and finding men who would win the youth for him. He knew he never could. VP could be very loving and charismatic and kind to people when he wanted something or their allegiance. I do not fault Doop or Heefner at all. They heard the Word in PFAL, which was Leonard's teaching and realized this was a great way to get the message out. It was a tool for them to spread the Word. All of the members in TWI were a direct result of Doop and Heefner. As we kids moved, we told others. The hippie kids got in TWI because of these two in CA and NY, some travelled to Kansas and other states - over a couple of years it moved out all over the country. Remember, the sixties and early '70s was a time of wandering, hitchhiking youth all over the place, a nomadic generation. Once Doop and Heefner were gone, you never had quite the explosion of the early years. Yes, people were won for a while after, mostly by men who had been with Doop and Heefner, but that leveled off, the explosiveness was lost. Once VP took the reigns it became rule oriented. I remember I was sorely disappointed in '71 when I was told I couldn't fellowship in Rye anymore, I now had to go to Larchmont fellowships. All of a sudden, the go where you want, fellowship with whoever, was being taken away. The rules started coming down, many of us started drifting away. It started becoming corporate under VPs rule - and I believe he knew exactly what he was doing, since, with the expulsion of Doop and Heefner, it was now "his" ministry. Yes, I have wondered what would have happened if VP hadn't stuck his finger in the pie and siphoned off, maybe one-third of the movement to himself.

"So, looking back.....what do I see?.......the 1970 growth spurt in twi was all manufactured." More specifically...... it is my contention that, along with the corps indoctrination camps...er, campuses, the mass-herding at big events: 1) PFAL '77, 2) Advanced Class '79, 3) Living Victoriously (1982), and 4) Sound Out '84 were catalysts for the mass formation psychosis in twi. Sure, there was some genuine outreach efforts and God-inspired actions/activity by many individuals, twigs, branches or even areas......but from centralized-hq, NOPE. Looking back, I don't think the herd-fests (i.e. big events) moved the needle in God's direction one bit.