bliss

I recently told an "innie" relative about VPW. She laughed, denied, called it rumor, and then said "I was in the motorcoach, and nothing happend to me!" SO!!! I run in the park alone sometimes too, and I have never been attacked! Does this ridiculous method of logic determine its validity? Not at all. How do you prove if you were victimized in any way? You have to go immediatley to the POLICE and get "examined". And even then, who's to say you weren't a willing participant? See how evil this whole mentality is? Don't forget the "innie" mentality either. We all were duped in one way or another. So being conned, groomed, lured, flattered, or seduced, by these leeches, would leave one stupified! You wouldn't be able to peice it all together because your thinking skills were put on hold for so long. I was never attacked or molested physically by anyone it TWI. But, I was molested with THEIR EYES and MOUTH. How do I prove this? Can't. But I know what I saw, how I felt, and what I heard. Just the mere fact that it is spoken by more than one woman is enough for me to believe. The proof is in their hearts.

I am with you on that one Smuda. To me the whole bible falls apart if Adam and Eve were only "figurative". Christ is the second Adam. His very coming is based on "man" in general yes, but, there had to be a first. Everything He accomplished for us, is based on them being literal. imo

I've got them. and they are "By THE WAY" articles. pm me

Quote:" we preach God's Word. We hold forth the Word, which is Jesus Christ." I DO have a problem with this statement. It is subtle, and sly. WE were BIBLE WORSHIPPERS! Instead of Christ followers. This is how it crept it. If we believe it this way, that JC is the word, therefore, we just speak the word, then, there is the "absense" of the real mediator in heaven for us. We were always told to "follow his example", ONLY. LCM also spewed MANY times, to never talk to Jesus, "we follow the Word". The impression was, "they are possessed" those people who "praise Jesus". So, don't tell me I wasn't taught that he is "absent" from my life. There is a difference between "KNOWING ABOUT'' Christ, and "KNOWING CHRIST". I NEVER had a RELATONSHIP! :( I had to get down on my knees and ask for forgivness from this ludicris belief I allowed to dominate my "non" thinking. :blink:

In the words of Tim McGraw (or the songwriter he sings for........) "Everybody just wants to get high, Sitting and watching the world go by We all are searching for love and meaning in our lives We follow the roads that lead us..................... To Drugs or JESUS." I always followed the roads to Jesus. Unfortunately, TWI was the wrong road. So, when it got to the point that I wanted to do drugs (lol) I took the fork in the road and got off that beaten path. Thank you Jesus!

You are so not alone here! welcome.

Hi T- I love all the new experiences I am having since our exit. I am doing things, and enjoying things I never thought was possible in TWI. I think for me, Proverbs 3 has been the key verse to help me in the "leaving" process. "Trust in the Lord with ALL thy heart and LEAN NOT unto THY own understanding; in ALL your ways, acknowledge HIM and HE will direct your path." I knew this verse while in TWI, but the impact it had on my after we left, is profound. I had to learn to trust GOD, not a man, not a ministry, not a class, not a book, not an ideology, not a group, not MYSELF! I had to give it all the Him, because we did NOT KNOW WHAT TO DO! In all our ways, gave it to HIM. "What is your pleasure Lord, what do you want us to do?" Down on our knees for the first time in our lives! And wouldn't you know it........................we ended up at the right place at the right time, to give us just what we needed, and it has changed our lives! Everyone learns, grows, needs, different things at different times. For us, we needed to stay in the fire, so to speak. When we didn't know what we were doing, had nowhere to go, (spiritually), it was the hardest, darkest time for us. Hubby, was depressed sort of. Not himself. Nor was I. But trusting in the Lord to bring us from darkness to light proved true for us. It is not in a church, a class or person.................. It is our Lord and God that we put our trust, and we are right where He wants us. To give HIM glory. Not ourselves, not others, not a ministry, not a class, not a way of thinking. Now I can say, I have liberty. I am "living" this abundant life I always wanted. It has nothing to do with money. It has to do with life and what I am going to do for HIM.

T- great analogy. The Way is STILL trying to fix the leak in the water bed. Unfortunately they ARE also aware of the SOURCE of the leaks. Just silly Wayfers aren't. So, they sit and watch them fix the leaks, but nothing really changes. So they wait.......... The kicker for me leaving was VPW. When I saw that he was totally out to lunch and did such unthinkable things, I knew FINALLY, right then, that this "ministry" was built on sand.

YEA!!!!!!!!! sea sprite??? cute

I still have the book. I did experience things in the book. They were not "tricks'' from people. (not that there aren't people who trick others, just not what I saw). Since I do believe in demons and/or spirits of the devil, then to me, that is what they are. I was very intrigued by the magic arts growing up. It was all in my searching for God. Witches, ESP, UFO's, Exorcisms, ghosts, draculas.........those were right up my alley sorta speak in research and questioning. All the while, going to church, sleeping with my rosary beads, and making the sign of the cross passing any church or ball game I played in.... One time a few friends and I "levitated" someone. We all were in a circle and we put two fingers only under their body. Then we repeat, "light as a feather, stiff as a board" about a million times.. One night, it worked! I can't say we weren't all a little freaked out....... :blink: I think the ones looking for it, find it. (or they find you ) Since I confessed Jesus as Lord, I don't need or experience anything "evil" in that way. I definately don't want it in my life, so I don't invite it in. I really feel I escaped pretty unscathed in light of my affilations. God sure rescued me. BTW: the book that the author recanted was "Babylon Mystery Religion". I still have that one too.

DITTO :)

TBone!!! I think there is a position for you in the Grease Spot Research Department. Thanks. "...Sometimes I think of prayer in my understanding as perhaps a verbal affirmation or agreement with God - that as I speak the words that I know I should say - I am aware of their reproof of some hidden hypocrisy they have flushed out of my heart - my conscious will not shut up!" Exactly my point. I have spoke it tongues so much, that I felt prayer with my understanding was inferior. Therefore, now that I am, really talking and hearing my prayers, I am readily aware of my faults, my problems, and what I need to address immediately. Back in SIT much days, I don't think I asked for true forgiveness for anything. It should be DAILY! I never learned to ask for forgiveness daily. Weird. I now teach my kids this. After 8 years of children's fellowship and countless nightime prayers!!! I am so disappointed. Now I at least can make up for it. I share with them to: "P" raise GOD- "God you are wonderful, you are the one who gives us strength. You are my provider......" "R" EPENTANCE- daily CONFESSION TIME , yes, I always missed this one. "A" cknowledgement- I acknowledge His right to rule and reign in my life. THIS IS THE "THANK YOU TIME"! "I" ntersession- Pray for others! "S"upplication- NOW I pray for myself. "E" quipping- Ask Him to equip me in every way for a victorious day. Give me eyes that I may see HIM and Ears that hear Him today. This is just the tip of the iceburg of what I have been learning since leaving the bondage and selfishness of the Way. I love it. I finally have a RELATIONSHIP with my Lord and God.

Conneron, sounds like you have a lot of stuff bottled UP!!! This is where you can get it off your chest. Where did you come from? Did you just find GS? I find your posts full of the VERY bad that went on behind the scenes, and I am sorry you had to go through that.

They are in Coral Springs, Florida. I might have their number around somewhere. Otherwise, try to look them up in phonebook online. They are doing good. Meg still makes notecards and John is working (not ministry) in sales. I think they are sorta in.

What about all the "gifts" or manifestations mentioned? It says 'to one, gift of tongues......to another gift of healing..." etc....? I really like what you said T-Bone. And it was interesting to note no other epistles has it. Just trying to put the puzzles together. You know, if God wants us to SIT, then I want to do it! I love him and want to please him. But I am not ready (mentally or doctrinally) to do it until I recheck everything. I totally disagree with how we did it in the Way. Practicing, and all was NOT INSPIRATIONAL. So that is definately lacking. So what is it if its fora sign to unbelievers? I use to get livid in fellowship if the Coord called on someone to SIT/INT when all of us were regulars!!!! When I ran it, it was always prophesy, unless a new person came. It was like they didn't head the written word, they just wanted everyone to practice even more. GEEEESH! If it ceased then, what are these people doing in so many churches? Vain babblings? :blink:

What is with M Wall@#$e and his obsession with "kids medical conditions??" I was traveling back in my mind and remember him constantly reminding me that my child was going to have developmental problems, and that I should " do " this or that. Even gave me a book on it. I know he was concerned because of what was NOT happening with my kid. But I as mother, wasn't. Fast forward years................Nothing "developmental" is wrong with my child. maybe he really wanted to be a "doctor" in life, but instead got lured into a cult. :blink: Sorry Cat. What access we gave to people because of our ''heart'' for God still baffles me. He will repay!

They are doing just that right now Coolwaters!!!!!! Staying and ignoring. What a way to live! I’m free, yeah, oh, I have been forgiven God's love has taken off my chains, and given me these wings And I am free, yeah, yeah and the freedom I've been given Is something that not even death can take away from me Because I'm free Jesus set me free Steven Curtis Chapman i am free, and no longer in bondage. Thankyou LORD! Add another TWI "generation" to the list..............

to top it all OFF................ my own "relative" said things that I couldn't believe I was hearing!!!! Quote: "see, you are searching for evil, so you found it "(regards to bad TWI press) When telling them about the fear of leaving or we would die scenario in the 90's, I got this..... "hahahahahah, you BELIEVED that?????" I said, "were we in the same ministry?" It seems that the oldtimers from way back, saw things with a "love, free spirit'' attitude. Not many liked Craig anyway, (they were ol wineskins ya know), so they just tiptoed through the tulips of Way land, all the while IGNORING Craig and just doing there own thing. :blink: So when I tell them "our side", they don't relate. WEIRD

Well, folks, I have had enough chit chat with some of my "innie" freinds. Most are totally unhappy with the Way. Some don't even ABS anymore because they found the teachings boring and unworthy to donate to. "They don't bless us, and there is no new research". Or, "I am just to old to leave. I don't want to start over. I have so much time, work and freinds. I don't have the energy''. Some dislike what "people" have done to the ministry. Yet, "it is still the BEST out there, the research we have, it is just that people mess it up, the ministry is made up of people. You are going to get that no matter where you go." They also think the adversary works "overtime" on Way believers. So when they mess up, they mess up BAD. One comment I found interesting........"since we are so into knowing the truth of the Word, WE SEE things from a Spiritual perspective, so it BOTHERS US MORE, to see peoples trash. Where as most church people are IGNORANT, therefore, they don't SEE the bad as much, therefore aren't as Bothered by all the crap the adversary does." :blink: Then they tell me to "think about it". lol I've thought about it alright.......................I've thought about how sorry I feel for these guys. I was there once too. These are all from different people within the last 2 weeks! I will just pray for God to OPEN THEIR EYES.

YUP, Danny! I have reproved more than a few for their "wrong" interpretations. :( How ludricris this sounds now, but if someones tongue was only ___, and their interpretation was ________________________________________________________________________________ _________________________________________________________________________________ _________________, boy did I get fumed!!! Just like if they said "I the Lord thy God love you , and God thankyou, ............" or, if they used any "unapproved words". Like create, hope in, wish, etc.... Or, if the poor soul said the same interpretation every fellowhip, or their tongue sounded the same, we often would have an "exceller session" to get practice. Yikes, this all sounds so "uninspiring" and the total opposite of the day of Pentecost and what Paul expounds. :blink:

How come the apostles didn't have to "practice" it? Jesus never said to do that? He said "wait". He also never "taught" them, it just happend. So how did they "just do it"? So whatever it is, it is NOT what TWI said it was. Oh wait, maybe they took PFAL first, ya know, during the 50 days of waiting. I always wondered what they were really doing in the upper room...... :blink:

I have to pipe in here. I think we are forgetting the one main word in these debates. "perspective" What Oldies says is right, ONLY in a sense of what was written/spoke by Wierwille. MCarrol is right, ONLY in a sense of what was implied/practiced/internallized/applied. Especially in the 90's. Some of you who are from the "oldWay" days, (no offence), have NO IDEA what twisting and the manipulating went on with what was from PFAL let alone just scripture. OR the yelling screaming, fear tactics that were in our face everyday. Those who weren't around for the free love Koombaya fellowships around "what you thought" was God's word, have NO IDEA how nice the Way could have been at one time, or even what "really" came out of that mans mouth. So lets give eachother a break when it comes to our perspective please. It really does shed light and makes a difference when we are discussing things.

((((((((mwah))))))))) Don't forget to get those spankins! have an awesome day

DUDE! Great day to you! :B)

Actually, Groucho, I think it HAS been repainted. That pic Chas sent really looks like it. Many B&B's around there too. I have climbed Pikes Peak, and every time I would try to find this exclusive, yet elusive, college, I mean seminary.... Never could find it. What is interesting, is that this "seminary" was in Manitou Springs, which is the like the spookiest, spiritualist, wacko town around. :blink: