dmiller

:)

Thanks for the input, Mark. :) (gives me a better perspective of the group and the author). I wondered about the conspiracy aspect. Wasn't sure if the book would be sensational, or factual. D.

Shucks -- I never heared that one (what SNS tape was it on)?? Good thing I never did -- my wife woulda *clocked* me big time!

Am on bended knees, smiting breast, and saying --- Mea Culpa! Mea Culpa! Mea Culpa!!! :D

There are times, Oldies, that I agree with you, and your last sentence is one of those times. or trying to pass this off as his own He was --- Or trying to say he did all the work (With A Little Help From My Friends), He did And (yea -- I know the name) -- but who was Elena Whiteside? Is a book with her name as author become *God-breathed* suddenly?? Oh --- wait. If Hartcourt/Brace/Javonovich publishers had done her book --- it might be more believable than one printed by American Christian Press. To me. However -- she (being a wafer) (she was, wasn't she?), talking to docvic (as a commentary), doesn't quite cut the mustard. Kinda like the cart interviewing the horse. Just (again) my IMO.

Bramble -- fer what it is worth, what you just said is more true than you think. (Ok -- here I am again on my soap-box) I have found (regardless of twi) that positive thinking works better than negative. The group home that I work at has 4 gents who are all mentally retarded (along with other disabilaties), and the minute you (I, or anyone else) thinks negatively about any situation, they pick up on it, and all hell breaks loose. We have two staff members there, that are *control freaks*. Nothing pleases them, they exude *negativity* in their every word and action towards the men that live there, and reap the results which end up in verbal and physical *altercations* between them, and the staff on duty at the time. Me -- (Mr. Laid-back-in-a-coma-kinda-guy), takes every negative thrown my way, and makes fun of it, turns it into a positive (if you will), and the next thing ya know, every one is happy, doing normal stuff, and no fights. I have ZERO PROBLEMS with the PMA outlook (Positive Mental Attitude). And when I am on duty -- we have NO problems whatsoever. :) However -- when either of the two other staff folks I mentioned are on duty, there are reams of notes in the daily log about how so-and-so (client) was un co-operative, was obsessing, had verbal and physical outburtsts, etc. Since these two treat our men like wayward children, they get what they ask for. To the detriment of the men that live there. But I'm using this to point out that talking negatives reaps the crop you have sown. If ya don't believe me -- come on over to Noumenon House, and work for a week with *My Guys*. Positive thinking gets you positive results. Whether or not twi promoted it. David

(my comments in bold) David

Thanks, Mary. :) I grant you that sometimes it is hard here to distinguish between genuine *dwelling on negatives* with honest reminiscing with no evil intent. Many here (as Mark put it so well), have come and gone, finding what they needed for themselves, and moving on (just as you suggested). Hey -- I have A VERY SERIOUS QUESTION FOR YOU How did Powerfilled get that pic of me (in my younger days) to use as his avatar????? :P :P :P David

Digi -- What a different interpretation of *Pushing up Daisies!!!* (but-I-kinda-like-it!!!!!!!) Fyi -- *pushing up daisies* has always referred to -- 6 feet under kicked the bucket sod in your face dead and buried. With your advanced skills in putting *new spin* to old sayings, Ya might thinks about writing a best-seller, A *new improved version of the scripture*, or ---- (shudderrrrrr) Even a new cult!!! (how long before I can't edit this???) :P David

Mary -- With all due respect, your first sentence negated the second. I'm not flaming you or anything like that. From the years 1975-1987 I also sat in MANY meetings with a bible on my lap as well. All run by twi. Foundational class Intermediate class Advanced class Heart-beat festivals Roa's Twigs Branch meetings Limb meetings Live class 1977 All the other seminars as well. Even sat in the shadow of the Black Hills of South Dakota on LEAD, bible in lap. Many here still revere God, His Word, and His Son Jesus Christ. Some do not, but for those of us that do --- We revere Him, and not the way. And simply because we (some of us) find fault with a man-made ministry, does not negate the truth of God or His Word, therefore He (and Jesus, and the Word) are still of value to us in our lives. David

Ahhh -- Bramble. I --- Was --- Just --- *Funnin* --- Am totally aware that solstices are a big deal to many folks (I've pulled out the fiddle and played for more May-Poles than I can remember), so I am NOT insensitive to the beliefs of others who may happen to disagree with me about things of this nature. Sorry if I offended you. I actually was debating wih myself as to whether to put *Y'all* or *You-uns* there, since ----- your *Yule* somehow reminded me of both! :) Peace, and Merry HannaRamaKwanzMasYule to you too. (I can be *all-inclusive* at times. ;) David

Indeed. Well said! It's been my experience though, that for every negative we dwell on, Here at Greasespot, we replace it with 3 positives! :biglaugh: Seriously -- while discussing the past injustices (and yes -- sometimes that falls into the category of dwelling on negatives), many other positive subjects are brought up and discussed, argued about, learned from, dismissed by some, accepted by others, etc. The venting about twi (imo) is a cathartic process that'll go on until the last of us are finally pushing up daisies. Kinda like old men sitting on *Liar's Bench* in the town square, "Hey Joe -- remember that time we wuz a'fishin, and I caught the really big one, and you said we should mark the spot with an *X*?? And then you wanted to put a big X in the boat??" "Yep I remember that, BillyBob. You done told me that I was a fool. Made sense when you said we may not get the same boat next fishing trip." ;) Taking about the injustices that happened years ago to some of us have transcended to this level of talk. Reminiscing, (mildly) complaining, but mostly reminiscing. Reminiscing about the *Good Old Days/Not So Good Days*. Like I said, it is cathartic. However --- there are some here who have just recently gotten free from twi, And if it will help them see what the org is really like, I'll keep on yappin' (till I'm pushing up daisies, that is!) David

Powerfilled -- great signature line!! B) B) B) Merry Y'all too! :D David

Mark (O'Malley) -- this is primarily to you. I just got *OPUS DEI* by Michael Walsh as a Christmas gift, and haven't yet started to read it, but the subtitle *secretive society within the Catholic church* made me want to ask --- Is this something you are familiar with, or is it a hoax??? I'll be reading it (either way), but I would appreciate a *head's up* from you. I guess I could have done a PM with this, but since it is a published book, I figured others may have seen it also, and might have similar questions. And ---- as our resident Catholic I figure you're the best one to ask for answers. (Besides all that -- I have a lot of respect for you and your wisdom). :) David

Ok. --- here goes. Docvic (plain and simple) took from other's works, and passed it off as his own. Some of us understand that, some don't, and some think he had a direct line to God, and got pfal from Him. Now ---- A simple analogy (if I may). I play the fiddle, mandolin, banjo, yada yada, and though I have often taken stuff from others to incorporate into my own *interpretation* of how a tune should be played, I have NEVER claimed it as my own, as has docvic and his *research* in his bible teachings. To be sure, what I garnered from others musically became *my style*, but *my style* is now, and always has been a recognizeable copying of what other folks have done in the past (hey -- there's recordings of all this stuff before I used it -- just like there's a lot of teachings before docvic came up with his stuff). I never threw out my old vinyl records (like docvic supposedly did with all his books) I learned from them, and used them to my advantage (as did docvic from others in those books, but he claimed authorship) Docvic copied (plain and simple), and called it his own. He wasn't willing to call a spade a spade --- Or give credit ------- He had to have it all. Plagiarism is something that he did willfully since it was touted to us all that he *threw out those books, and studied on his own*. I have several friends who are teachers, and are familiar with the concept of plagiarizing. If you want me to (Mike), I can ask them what their standards are for a test, or a report, or a term paper. Me thinks that docvic would flunk their test. But that is just my imho. :) David

Hmmm. Like Stiles, Bullinger, Kenyon, etc., etc., etc.??? Guess we travelled in the *wrong* circles, eh? ;)

Moony -- you sound like a *fire person*. Always poking a stick into a campfire, getting them embers just right!! ;)

Lifted -- I remember reading about that in the local paper.Whatever did happen to him??? update -- Mayor Bergson is taking a 6 month suspension (voluntarily), and will be attending re-hab, and sitting in on group discussions made up of members of MADD, and other's who are members of families that have experienced devastation as a result of drunk driving. I wish him the best. To his credit -- he did say in his initial address to the city (about the incident) --

All disagreements about *nothing*, and ending with *fine* --- Are usually preceeded by THE LOOK. :blink: Men -- you know the one I mean --- Her hands on hips or arms are crossed, head slightly cocked sideways elevating one eye over the other, chin pressed closer to her chest as if to peer over glasses, tight thin line where her mouth used to be and sometimes accompanied by toe-tapping too. When I see THE LOOK --- I know it's time to get outta Dodge!!!

Dang! Now we have to *master* something else, besides pfal! :P

Mea Culpa -- Lifted --- I apologize I see I should have added the words *extra moisture* before the unfrozen water statement. Sorry. David

Lifted -- you neglected to quote what I said in it's entirety. Since you missed it, I provided it for you above. :)

C Geer has no part of CES. Nor does CES think docvic is 100% right (correctly so). David

Even in my most *in* days of being an *innie* of twi, I never, ever, once, consisidered docvic's words *God-Breathed*. While he said many times *It's the Word, the Word, and nuthing but the Word* I never heard him say *It's the Orange Book* *It's the Blue Book* *It's the Green Book* Etc., etc., etc., Whatcha think, Mike??? Did docvic ever say it's the Orange, Blue, or Green book like you do????

Oh boy -- can't wait for the answer (if there is one) to this!! :D :D :D