Ham

Few more thoughts for Larry about the restitution thing.. Romans 12:18 If it be possible, as much as in you lieth, be at peace with all men. I think this is a universal truth, that some of these guys are ignoring. To their own peril. I've seen some people have some pretty bad practical consequences by not heeding this.. it always seems to have a way to come back and bite a person in the a**. blaming it on the devil for being "mean" to oneself.. or blaming others is pretty fruitless.

Looking at it even BIBLICALLY.. maybe that's why it says an "overseer" is to be BLAMELESS. What I see in these (not all!) offshoot guys.. with their track record, nobody in their right mind would ordain them for any legitimate position. Soooo.. what to do? Ordain YOURSELF. "You'll be sorrrrrrrry.."

It's just.. I really think, if a person can't "come clean", be honest.. they are better off letting somebody else enjoy the "icing on the cake", i.e. "teaching the word".. Maybe this isn't too far off the topic here.. maybe "where's Chris Geer?" is a good philosophical question..

I could hear somebody saying "what about the apostle PAUL, what about DAVID".. I could almost hear it coming.. David accepted the responsability for HIS trail of blood.. so did Paul.. These hucksters who cut their teeth on "leadership" in a cult? Naw. "We're FREE in Christ. Don't you DARE touch MY righteousness with 'baseless' accusations.." It's almost like they are schizophrenic or something.. One personality pimps and totes a firearm, the other teaches da bible.. That at least makes a little sense to me. Here we have two, radically different descriptions, of the same person. And I believe sincerely that both parties are relating what they observed as honestly as possible..

Personally, I think it is kind of cowardly, leaving it to one's followers to explain or rationalize the trail of blood leading to one's door..

Mistakes are one thing.. I would suggest if he CANNOT at least ADDRESS his "mistakes", he is not qualified for "office". People point to the apostle Paul.. well, he was a MURDERER. He admitted it. He called himself the chief of SINNERS. I can't say he SATISFIED every person he wronged, or every relative of Stephen, or others, or relatives of others he harmed. He admitted he persecuted the Church of God. I don't see this in some of these other guys.. "I was a pistol bearing thug in a cult, practically a PIMP for der 'man of gawd', I defamed, slandered and worse.." Instead, they just "move on" with "the GREATNESS(?) of der verd.." No, I'm not angry, at the moment. It's just an observation. I don't think he's doing anybody any favors. How would a person feel, to find their best friend was secretly a cannibal, or worse.. these moggie types have too many people following them that eventually may be blindsided with this crap.. and he hasn't cleaned it up. I see the same thing occur here over and over.. "Well, that wasn't the (fill in the name) that *I* knew.." Blindsided. So dear mr. moggie has just punched another follower in the stomach.. Just an observation.

I wouldn't argue with your personal experience.. but. How is it that these guys who acted as counsellors for darkness, ruined lives, slandered saints.. and did even worse.. it's like they vanished into a wormhole or something, and end up on the other side of the world as a seemingly "nice guy", "man of gawd", "beloved teacher..", "worthy of RESPECT". I really don't think they are doing anybody any kind of favor. The evil they did in the past WILL catch up with them, sooner or later. Geer was practically a friggin pimp, a pistol toting thug.. What kind of damage does that really do to the trust a person has in others? "well, I thought he was a nice guy.." I think without addressing past evil and making restitution, he's just spreading more evil around..

I "flunked" spatial. Makes sense, when I was a kid, my idea of stopping a baseball was to let it just bounce off of me..

Another thing.. rehashed, reboxed pfal.. why bother trying to sell it, to those who have bought it again, and again, and again. I bought pfal at least.. six times. foundational.. $85.00. intermediate, 35 (I think). Advanced, $550.00. WAP "repackage" of pfal- I forget how much.. it wasn't free. loy's "new and improved" advanced class.. I forget.. but it was in hundreds.. plus two "pfal" classes, repackaged from an offshoot. Every time I hear "you gotta take this class.. it's the finest since Paul invented liver and onions.." I think they are trying to sell an eskimo snow in the winter..

I tend to agree with everybody, just not the same point, at the same time.. :)

They say that is why they have a hard time propagating besides..

Well.. as long as cats don't disembowel squirrels, I suppose we are alright here..

What is an ENTS? I don't know if it is an ENTS, but it very well could have been a ROUS. They reside in the fire swamp. Well, that would explain the tail..

Could it have been Joe Fair?

Even in the good old days.. A lady came to the limb guy.. hand picked by the vicster himself.. she needed some advice. "This guy is REALLY REALLY icky. Won't keep his hands off me in twig" mr. "icky" had some money.. "Haven't we talked about this BEFORE? Do we have to go over all of this AGAIN? WHY DON'T YOU JUST GET LAID AND LOOSEN UP???!!!" I really wasn't trying to listen.. this was through two solid doors it was so loud. Counsel? You have got to be kidding.. I would call them counsellors from hell..

My last "counselling" session with these vey hacks was not by my request. "We KNOW that something is wrong with you. If I were you, I'd spill my guts.." Hmmm. Forgot to brush my teeth? Wore a shirt with a "devilish" pattern on it to "fellowship"? Friggin meddlers.. they were trying to MANUFACTURE problems. "Problems" that they could solve with the wave of the magic wand. They were searching under every rock they could to find some point that they could at least appear to their superiors to be "prevailing". If I made up a bunch of crap, fell to my knees, said with tears in my eyes "you're right. I hear voices, I'm a homo, I'm a Democrat, I belong to PETA.." they would find a miraculous "cure", and I'd be in der ministry today. In the real world, I think it is at least slightly unethical to corner somebody, and try to force one's "services" upon them. Last group that offered any kind of "counselling".. within the last FEW years.. one of the teachings practically implied that if you were a Liberal, if you wouldn't turn "homo", at the least you were "compromised".. as a BIBLE teaching.. no joke. "we'll counsel you.." deliverance? what are they gonna do? Cast the Liberal "spirit" out? Let the "spirits" out with a dull bone knife? Gotta be kidding.. Oh. I HAVE gone to a "real world" counsellor since.. and the difference is like night and day..

The problem is that these guys had to break a whole heck of a lot of yokes before they got it right. If indeed they really do have it "right" at the present. What I learned through twi, was distrust of any kind of counsellors, period. I saw the meanness engendered between husband and wife, and usually they came out of "counselling" worse than they entered, especially if they did what the "counsellor" suggested. One ordained female clergy laid into this guy for ... and when he refused to do what she suggested, she SCREAMED the one size fixes them all accusation- "you're not listening to me because you are POSSESSED". A YEAR and a HALF later, she kinda of admitted that she just MIGHT be wrong.. and she was leading these people in the way of divorce. This kind of counselling was typical. I didn't want their counsel. I rather would live with my problems.. no details here, but in my life it had a few consequences. Still, things could have been even worse if I sought them out for their great "wisdom". I'd be in a nut house..

Another reason I come.. 5,000 posts! Kinda like climbing Mt. Everest, just cause it's there..

Yep.. they CAN'T. Can only jump through hoops for so long before you wear out your "jumper".. Too bad though. Those leaving, or planning to leave, may not have sufficient time to jump through the "world's" hoops to acquire any substantial wealth, or decent retirement. Too bad also.. some of them have learned their "craft" quite well under rosie and donnie's "tutelage". Why work, just start another cult..

Blood Sweat and Tears. The original, with Al Kooper. The first song, "overture" is just amazing..

This is probably what rosie (not to mention her sidekick) use. The best toilet paper in the world Only in their case, the paper is not working.. doggone link won't work. I see the board censors the name of the link. www.s*itbegone.com You'll have to replace the * with an h.

I still think at best a person can only be prepared. One of my friend's ambitions here is simply to have enough resources set aside to pay for their final internment. I don't know if a person can be ready, exactly. You'd be bartering with the man in black at the last minute.. "hey, hey.. just five more minutes, I haven't finished with my LIST yet.."

One reason I like to come back to this place: I can explore a few new ideas with others. Well, new ideas to me, without getting clubbed with der verd or something like that.

If you want some respect from other drivers, put one of those socker ball emblems in the rear window. Anybody in their right mind KNOWS that such a person MUST be at fifteen places at the same time, and that their demeanor is not entirely "happy". They won't dare cut you off, or even honk because of a minor infraction.. Not even for a major infraction..

My literature professor knew the difference between the three. If I remember correctly, vic used an illustration for those figures that he lifted from Bullinger..