Ham

OK. I'll accept that. But it sounds to me a lot like this article.. Maybe that's nice and all.. but: Who are the *others*" you claim to be "in it" for, when you say "put up or shut up.. ya know the drill.." "gimme EVIDENCE.." "don't wanna see THEM maligned.." Who do you exactly "represent" here?

So.. I reissue the question.. "what's in it, for YOU"? just a thought.. if it ISN'T about *you*.. then to me, it kinda logically falls under the 99 percent category.. who one LOVES, who one OWES, who one PAYS..

I personally spent well over twenty years in the organization, working a second rate job, not continuing education.. to be "available" to supposedly move the word.. to be able to have the free time to help run classes.. meetings.. be "free" to go to meetings.. I had a night job once.. real possibility of advancement, education.. you'd think.. "well, thank GOD He opened doors for ham like this.." naw.. "grrr.. and why CAN'T you come to twig? To classes? etc.. etc.." What's ironic.. we fought to have just a TINY bit of individuality in this life.. and how easily some of us were convinced to just throw it away.. ninety nine percent of this life is about other people. People we love, people we owe, people we pay.. nobody gets the one percent that's left from me, at least today..

and some of us have abandoned that fallacious form of reasoning... knowing FULL WELL that we can't love someone else, until we REALLY learn to love ourselves, and not limited to vic's, loy's, or twi's definition..

I mean.. why in the world would one dress one's self up as an effigy of vic, or loy.. or someone equally as nasty and subverted.. and then complain when the effigy gets beat with sticks here? Where is the logic in this? try to stuff all that dirt back under the carpet again.. "come back to da VERD".. "tow the line like a good little believer.." It's like.. dressing up like a chicken at a crocodile convention.. just an observation.. either it's pure ignorance, or it has some kinda purpose or agenda.. who knows.. maybe it's innocent. Maybe they LIKE being a chicken.. I dunno.. I dressed up as the Squirrel and showed up at a squirrel haters internet forum once. I just wanted to see if they had a sense of humor.. I dunno.. it's not "personal".. I'm just trying to understand here. Maybe.. maybe they are masochistic or something.. I dunno. I'm not exactly masochistic.. I exited the squirrel haters club fairly quickly and graciously.. "sorry you don't have a sense of humor here.." and I just LEFT.

I dunno.. if I was a new poster at this site, I'd probably think twice before telling my story to be castigated by accusations of falsehood, repeated demands for court documents supporting my claim, demands for EVIDENCE.. rejection of confirming eyewitness testimony.. "God save da Mog".. So what's the tactic here.. hmm. Maybe it's to discredit the claims by "forcing" the one making the claim to appear practically insane, desperately trying to convince the supposed ill informed denier that the events indeed happened? Honestly.. that's probably it.. one way to "deal" with offenses I suppose. The "fight" here isn't technically with the one denying the claim. It's with the corrupt organization that allowed it to happen, or was directly involved in the offense involved. Or those in the organization who directly caused the harm. But I think some people willingly throw themselves in front of the steam roller here.. why? I dunno.. maybe to take the heat off of their precious mog, mogette, or memory of the same.. perhaps to them, it's "just" an internet site.. we're not *people*.. we're *just* screen names.. I've been fairly honest about my twi experience. And why I'm here.. Interesting I've never gotten a reply from the other side "what's in it for YOU".. "oh, it's not about *me*. I just don't wanna see somebody ELSE lynched with false accusations" That's not what I asked.. not "what's in it for OTHER PEOPLE".. What's in it for YOU, personally? See.. it's not your fight. That is, unless you happen to be the vicster, rosie, the loyster, the donster.. "he who never mixes his bread and vegetables".. or one of their close cronies.. one who committed offense to God's people.. why put yourself in their place?

I'm suprised nobody currently on staff voted. Well, not suprised.. bit I didn't want to be rude and pull in the "welcome" mat.. j.l.. don't be afraid to vote.. it's perfectly anonymous. You won't get "possessed" or anything..

then they taught "no condemnation".. and proceeded to castigate people if there was dust on the top of the refrigerator.. or if they forgot their leadership's pets birthday, sent a store bought birthday card to der mogster instead of slaving hours making a hand made one, or something equally inane. Interesting.. I never got a hand made card from the loyster.. too busy "moving da word" I guess..

I dunno how anybody else thinks.. My personal nature DEMANDS that I make some kind of difference here.. at least in this life.. der vey offered a few shorcuts.. I'm glad I didn't take them up on them all.

I don't think so. . see.. we really haven't gone anywhere.. a lot of us who were "turned out".. left to our own "devices".. We are still here. the just "go ahead.. be peaceful.. be filled..".. a lot of us were previously filled with nonsense.. that's what a lot of us have heard.. where have some of us gone.. the "world" that was claimed to be so "ungodly".. the "cup of reality" we offer.. perhaps it is that the "one size spirituality fits all" does not really fit.. I kind of view twi as some kind of failed "experiment"..

Glad to see you are OK.. at least I hope. maybe the moral to the story.. have a damn cheap computer that you don't have any personal info on.. at least to surf the net with. this piece of junk here doesn't do video or youtube very well.. but all the worms or trojans in the world aren't gonna find a whole heck of a lot ..

Well.. staff can simply close a thread to no further contribution, and leave it in open, or about der vey.. where anyone can read it, logged in or not. One can reference it with a search, just not bring it back to the top. I think one of my threads would have to start going pretty sour before I'd request it. But it is an option.

Quite true. Maybe that's why some "leadership" was kinda nutso.. I've read that a lot of the corps experience for some people involved rather broken sleep schedules. Sleep deprivation proved to be a better interrogation technique than torture.. just keep waking people up every forty five minutes or so.. no rem sleep.. eventually they break..

Maybe a good option.. maybe it just hasn't been used.. why doesn't the starter of the topic merely request someone on "staff" here to close the thread, when he or she feels everything to be said has already been said? If people still want to fight and brawl.. let em start their own thread..

Pond, I think it would just work BETTER. Especially if the subject is emotionally charged.. or controversial. One of the few topic starters that I can think of who employ this method is Roy. No, he doesn't rule his threads with a rod of iron or anything.. but he RESPONDS to practically every single contribution. And his threads are effective. They tend to stay on topic.. The other poster is Satori. The few threads he started, he seems to reply to the contributions and incorporate their relevance to the subject at hand. Or point out the lack therof.. Other threads are more specific, and just don't leave much room to get off topic. I don't think it takes days on end.. nursemaiding a computer or anything.. just a little attention.

heheheh. I was wondering if you'd remember that.. *%$# mail truck.. right on Ashman Street, in the bike lane.. I'm pedalling back to the house.. just like any other day.. nothing was ever there before.. Probably shoulda gone to the emergency room.. poor dear wow brother.. I wonder how he's doing.. if you are reading dear "brother".. pm me and I'll see to it that you get the front forks of the bike replaced.. and the wheel..

I dunno.. seems to me, once one learns how to ride a bike, one never forgets how. I think the little "stowry" sounds a little fishy. Straight handlebars, crooked.. the dynamics of riding a bicycle don't really change.. one would know the moment mounting the bike that the handlebars were "adjusted".. how can one learn to ride a bike in the *wrong* manner? Either it works, or it doesn't. what I think the little illustration did was to try to assert that learning to do something the RIGHT way, i.e. the vicster's way, can be "uncomfortable". Just let the "master" spiritually straighten things out for you.. "but don't blame me if you run into a telephone pole" I never ran into a telephone pole. I did run into the back of a mail truck that was illegally parked in a bike lane once though. Didn't do much to the truck..

I would agree. A lot of those who would really make a difference were turned into administrators, class runners, report makers.. "low MAINTAINENCE *believers*" I heard that label given to people.. just don't have any "problems" or honest questions.. keep the blue forms coming, on time.. and the white forms..

perhaps. I think a lot of people don't consider that there is a living, human being on the other end of *that* opinion that may be offered at the time.. that's the "problem" with this format of communication.. Many offer themselves FREELY to this mix of humanity.. a lot drop their inhibitions.. think it is a safe place to do so.. reveal things we wouldn't tell our aunt or uncle.. along with a modicum of anomymity.. as far as common respect is concerned, I TRY to give it, and not expect it. The hams have a "fix" to this kinda problem.. the person is called "net control". It's the guy who starts the "thread" so to speak. If somebody wants to speak, it's through him. He reigns over the discussion, keeps it relevant, keeps the contributers in line.. Some threads here, I've seen the net control guy starts something and just jumps ship.. show up every few days or so, to see how things are going.. I guess I'm thinking out loud too..

heheh. I will gladly wear either description, or both, if or when they apply.. Sometimes though.. common sense would suggest to me.. that after thirty nine pages on the same subject.. I mean.. what's gonna be said has already been said..

I dunno. When it hits twenty, thirty.. forty pages.. maybe the said thread holds a different, useful purpose. And after forty some pages, what do you expect? People have already forgotten what the brawl is really about.. but really.. I know the forum rules.. try not to keep it "personal".. but how does one do that, and really *connect* with other people.. at some point it IS *personal*.. and may I add- REAL. jumping in at the fortieth page or so.. and asking Paw to save the "honor" of a thread is kinda futile.. I've seen some try recently. It just seems to me.. any RELEVANT (at least to the topic at hand) discussion has happened on the first three pages or so. Maybe.. the dynamics of things demand that one start a NEW thread.. not to ask that one intervene.. "fix" a woebegone thread.. take what's "relevant" to one's way of thinking.. or inquiry.. and RUN WITH IT.. well, it's just a thought.. :)

"good luck" well.. perhaps the strategy would be to start a new thread, where those who are blugeoning each other with the proverbial lead pipe will follow along to.. but that doesn't work most of the time either.. I've tried.. maybe it's a calling. "Here am I, blugeon me" I'm starting to think: that's why SOME people come here to begin with..

true. Unfortunately in der vey, they tossed the "Pauls" out on their ear, and fouled their name with descriptions of devil possession so no one would believe them.. most of those who confronted met answers such as "well, it's ok if you're spurtual enough.." then they didn't last much longer in "gawd's" ministry..

they tell me I smell pretty ripe when my fur is wet.. Not so bad as to use Mogbegone. Just a little Febreeze..

Oh yes.. "confrontation".. they had a whole "decade" of it I think.. I've seen "confrontation".. more like damage control. 1. ISOLATE the "incident".. this was the PRIMARY goal. Kinda like hazardous waste. Keep "it" from getting on anybody else.. put up a yellow tape around the "site".. "do not cross" devils wait on the other side.. 2. "educate" the few who are aware of the "incident". i.e. label the victim as possessed, weak, etc. etc.. Give a dozen or more good "biblical" reasons why disaster occured.. make sure they won't "glorify der debil" by talking about the incident with anyone outside of the small "cell".. It's STILL just sweeping more dirt under a carpet somewhere..