Ham

Forgive me Ms. Garland. I really don't think you were singing about H.E.W... No, don't burn him. I think it would be far more entertaining if he did a song and dance routine.

I sent it.. we'll see. I can imagine the reply.. "nawww, I kicked around in the underworld a coupla years.." Thanks for the link JL..

a link provided by mr Lingo on another thread.. http://sowersonline.com/default.aspx I'm gonna email the guy. Ask him.. "did you just happen to be born on May 20 or 21, 1985?"

I thought this one was a likely candidate.. A pretty young starter in the business this time around, but maybe it's not him. there's about a seven year gap or so.. Then maybe it could be.. maybe he was on vacation somewhere for a while..smoking big fat cigars, floating on a cloud.. wearing a halo(?) nawwww..

Are you entirely sure about that? not the not worth messing with.. but the dead are dead, and their time has passed. I keep watching the news, looking for someone about say.. about twenty-two years old, who got caught in an imaginary black snowstorm, got tangled up in a newfangled xerox machine, and claims to have knowledge of der verd as it hath notter been known since the earth cooled.. I'll probably never see it. They probably wouldn't consider it very newsworthy

Yeah, they interviewed a lot of the people in the people's temple.. I would imagine a lot of them didn't think it was a blood thirsty cult before the "founder" started passing out the kool aid, and forcing the flock to drink. Maybe the only difference between jones and vic in 1976- vic didn't go AS far off the deep end about his conspiracies and have some kinda "vision" that people were better off doing themselves in..

I'm waiting for some poor soul to say "well, none of the apostles had an accredited education.." True, but none of the apostles went to a degree mill so they could buy a piece of paper to prove that little point either..

What do you do with one. Hmm. You've spent a mere quarter of what a real degree would cost.. what a "bargain" 1. The credits WON'T transfer. Probably not even to another "distance learning" university like the one you got it from.. 2. It WON'T look good on a resume.. in fact, one's chances of getting the job probably double, just by not including it.. 3. Somehow a person can STILL be functionally illiterate.. can't count, can't understand world events, can't understand history, or how government really works, or how it really doesn't.. can't understand any major literary works, or understand the development of western civilization.. The only POSSIBLE motivation I can think of.. unless you can attribute it to the naivete of youth- it gives the "bearer" the qualifications to start another damned cult.. just another leverage point to show how "devilish" the world can be, and "persecute" the person, when it calls one's qualifications into question.

Thanks Roy. :) He seems to like to tout his "Doctor" label. I have a bad habit.. I just HAVE to read the ingredients on the label.. drives some people nuts. "Why don't you just EAT it.." I read the label.. "naw, go ahead.. you eat it. I'm sure it's nutritious and all.." That's just what I was thinking! I've got about 110 credits from one of "those" places. Think they'd transfer to whatchamacallit bible institute?

apparently the "class" requirements don't include: English 111 English 112 Physics I, or Chemistry.. No Algebra, not even remedial.. no history, unless they have something on church history or something.. No pscyology classes.. No Literature of the twentieth century, or twenty first, for that matter.. No economics 101.. or statistics.. in fact, it looks like they don't even offer these. so a person could theoretically go through their process, and come out functionally illiterate.. and the "credits" don't transfer. But.. you've got the paper on the wall..

Hmm. Looks like another "distance learning" institution.. Is it possible.. bachellors, masters and doctorates are rolling out faster than a toddler working over a roll of toilet paper..

What I wonder.. where'd he get the doctorate?

sometimes I think we get what we REALLY ask for. "what kinda organization am I really involved with.." I think.. no matter where you are at any one particular time.. things are really screwed up. but don't ask.. "what's REALLY in us.." unless you are fireproof.. :) I asked that once.. made the brown acid look like a little walk in the park.

are you sure he isn't half cat?

why WAS vic so "mesmerized" or fixated by the paranormal? Forming a Cult 101: choose and define an "enemy"..

Welcome to the Cafe, Man. I *kinda* agree. But I think that's the real purpose of all religions.. I think that "Christianity" may just be a little more subtle and refined at some points, and perhaps more aggressive and coercive at others than other religions. They don't enforce rules by cutting off hands, public hangings (at least anymore) and the like.. but seems they are fond of putting people out of the camp where debils supposedly rule. Over rather insignificant matters too. That is kinda barbaric. As far as freedom of will is concerned.. I think we made a few "agreements" with "them" before we were born.. :)

what amazes me, is the amount of ceremony that was lavished on what can spiritually be considered a greasy hamburger and fries. And the rather strict "don't answer any questions before the end of the class.." everybody in the seat, exactly on time.. reused styrofoam cups properly reconditioned, and HOPEFULLY bleached.. coffee stretched properly.. PRECISE fen minute break between sessions.. tapes cued up to the precise one second mark before the audio started.. later video. Charts flipped at the PRECISE moment, in the audio only version.. No questions, NO NOTES was the standard for how long.. and you stand for the instructor. I've NEVER seen students stand for da teacher in ANY college setting.. and I've NEVER seen it taken as an insult by the instructor either. It was like an old Bugs Bunny cartoon where all they had was a bean for supper. "Use your imagination. Would you like light or dark meat.." What's even more incredible.. der vey will in all likelihood have to resurrect it..

Interesting. Well.. every single class I've had on the university level the instructor was HAPPY to answer questions along with the lecture. I go to a smaller, ACCREDITED university. Even with a class size as large as fifty.. the psychology professor would answer questions during lecture, and somehow *miraculously* stay on schedule. And that was psychology 100. Supposed to cover the "basic keys" and all.. basic vocabulary. They include extra time for questions in their overall plan. "Maximum learning, in a minimim of time" certainly would include answering questions. "well, if you don't *get it* the first time through, just take it again.." I wouldn't be exactly a happy customer if that were the case with math 472, math 402.. The other thing I think holding of questions to the end does.. one cannot address errors when they occur. My complex analysis professor has a standing offer of one point for each error any student in the class can find in the lecture. I scored one point last night.. :) The guy has a real, honest to God LEGITIMATE doctorate in mathmatics.. Been teaching for DECADES.. and from his demeanor, the only thing that would make one think he had the degree.. is that he really knows his stuff, and cares enough to make sure people "get it right" the first time around.

I heard the story. It *seemed* to bolster the vicster's claims about the debil spurt kingdom, at least as he understood it. So, in a cultish kinda sense, yes, I believed it at the time. But what I NEVER heard.. was the RECORDED audio tape of a certain "lightbearer"'s interview with .. Swatratra. In fact, I never heard of this until Greasespot. Mabye even the old vicster himself knew it was just too ridiculous for the "ordinary" believer to swallow.. I know of some people who claim they woke up from a dead sleep with a devil trying to squeeze the life out of them or something like that. The only thing I can think is.. reality is harder for some to accept.. I've had some "weird" things happen in life too.. but the interpretation of the said events is really only up to me..

"Listening with a purpose".. what was the deal with that? Who's purpose? "what is the greatest secret in the world today.." "well, duh.. maybe it's.. the seats here are too hard.." I think it was more of a little test. "are you COMPLYING with what's being presented?"

I think that's what I paid for. Reall.y. Marched through thirty six hours of mind numbing "personal"(?) indoctrination on open reel AUDIO ONLY format Be on your metal seat on time, don't ask questions. The automated process will be suspended at the end of the mystical 36 hours to answer your little troublesome question.. Later came the video.. big deal.. just saved some poor guy from the minute timing of flipping the charts.. no, the "teaching" was never live. So I went through the twi drive through service for spiritual success.. now they want a "tip"? ten, fifteen percent of the price of the product? No, of my income.. I'd like to see McDonald's try it. Ronald won't even spit in your direction unless you leave fifteen percent of your income at the little booth..

I think the "hold the ketchup, hold the questions" strategy merely allowed one to wade through thrity six hours of mind numbing minutae which left one so numb that the poor person couldn't remember that they had questions, no less remembering what they really were..

I wonder if "they" ever realized.. having maybe a mountain of clothes.. a bottle collection that spans five decades of ardent searching.. fifteen bags of old clothes someone is planning on using to make a quilt or something SOMEDAY.. a rather fully stocked food pantry.. a half a basement of old electronic gear that doesn't mean something to anybody else.. just might make someone HAPPY? I might make an exception, and at least as far as saying something.. when it's like two hundred cats, all produced by one version of inbreeding or another.. and seventy or more on the way.. I don't think the person needs to burn the chaff.. maybe they need some real HELP. I think this "burn the chaff" concept.. travel light, travel far.. only really applies to the few who actually travel. But somehow they wanted even the regular Joe Believer to be ready to move at a moment's notice if gawd "opened the door"..

You know, the meat cleaver is an elegant weapon.. it has a "civilized" edge, unlike the ordinary light saber or blaster..

Perhaps, but not as openly as before. I really really doubt that they have anyone on staff as bad as loy.. or who has the unfettered freedom to act as he did. I'll bet they put a FEW safeguards into effect. Don't want yet ANOTHER real big lawsuit.. and we do have a lot of what is in public record about the evidence. It wasn't an entire loss.. it got big forehead out of office too, didn't it?