Ham

true, but sometimes I think being able to properly pronounce "pneuma" or other such words only applied a veneer of legitimacy on some of the madness.

sadly, the "contest" looks like a group of men wielding clubs.. with bystanders taking bets on who is going to be the last one left standing.. it USED to be, he who knew more greek words and memorized enough of old "doc"'s stuff had the bigger club.

I dunno. I don't think we were ever really dead at any one given time..

"I've become my own grampa.." luckily for me, they didn't live much beyond fifty..

why is it.. some become the "preacher of righteousness" that they despise.. or at least despised at one time in their life..

He's on a mission..

were you? I wasn't. Someone USING the bible taught me how to IGNORE those emotions, how to disregard them, can them up, or "rein them in". How to suck it in, and take one more punch for "the lord".. Put off? No. "Grieve with them that grieve, mourn with them that mourn" must be innappropriate. Just put em off.. Israel MOURNED for what was it.. sixty days for the death of Moses.. mustve been some pretty rotten "believers".. only the priest could not mourn, for father, for mother..

Double post friend, but it was worth saying twice. :)

Thanks, that did it. Now I've got another song to deal with all day.

Some people walked off thinking "if that's how a God has to work, there must not even BE one.."

A lot of us thought that when we left the "hallowed walls" of "zion", we were leaving God behind.

I don't wanna grow up, I'm a Ways 'R Us kid.. There's a zillion weird unique doctrines that I can play with.. more classes and "twigs", training programs and gigs, It's the biggest(?) and baddest thing there is! I don't want to grow because then if I did.. I wouldn't be a Ways 'R Us kid! Help get this song out of my head..

A bad acid trip is a walk in the park compared to what some of these people went through..

Having to explain to someone in admissions that you put off getting a degree, in what you're REALLY good at until you're fifty because you p*ssed away twenty five years in a "religious group" (note that I'm being kind here) isn't really all so bad..

And to the "old geezers" on the "board", I say: If it's just a matter of midlife crisis, or change or something.. go to the local store, get a bottle of "herbal calm" or something.. figure out how to ride the wave of the hormones and brain chemicals. Worked for me. Though some may need something a little "stronger".. :) Then go back to school or something.. get a hobby.. get a degree maybe.. make a REAL difference for somebody.. even if it's secular.. being a fifty some year old "waysRus" kid is kinda pathetic.. the bible will actually STILL be around fifty or so years from now, despite your efforts or lack therof.

The only difference between me and them: I was partly prepared to deal with what was going on.. and I could still function somewhat normally in society at the time. Go to work, talk to friends, etc.. Probably scared the hell out of some of them.. I can see how these poor folks could just give up..

Maybe if one has never had been knocked that far out of equilibrium, they just can't understand it.. when it happened to me it was surreal.. I had built up some logical reasoning before then. Found myself looking at myself saying.. oh, I know what brain chemicals those are.. I'm probably STILL nuts.. naw.. the lady in the white smock says I'm OK.

I dunno. What appears insignificant for one, may be devastating for another. Imagine finding that your "loving" wife is being "boinked" by another man. Not too "big" a deal- "just get over it".. but the other "man" is supposed to be one who lives "the word" in a manner that his life is above reproach. The betrayal is more than two-fold.. he's also your employer. you've been taught to suppress strong emotions, such as anger, revenge, etc. by this very "man".. and you find yourself having a stream of emotions that you are in no way prepared to deal with.. in a flash, you realize that almost EVERYTHYING you've been told is just plain WRONG.. You're "done".. twenty years on the job, and you can't bring yourself go to work another morning, and be subservient to one who performed this act of betrayal.. so where do you go.. you have no savings, to speak of.. and the world is full of "devils" waiting to jump you when you walk off grounds.. you leave, and your wife stays behind. The "boss" makes sure of that.. you walk off the grounds, without the wife, without friends, no income, no trust in other human beings, and no God.. you tell me. this guy lost his life over it.. I've had to look at darkness straight in the face.. maybe not to this degree.

ever stop for a moment and think that perhaps.. what happened to other people FELT the same to them? :)

Yep. It's even an honorarily bestowed, good as the paper it's printed on Doctor of Squirrelogy

Hey.. you have to know what you're working with here..

Hmm. I guess we DO "remember" them who "labored(?)" among us..

How'd you guess??

He ended up being a rev at twenty-something..

I think the old ministry raised up a bunch they could BRIBE.. those who couldn't be bought were often run off.. like Geek, Ralph.. others. MANY of the rest had character with the constitution of water.. fast growth seemed to put a heck of a lot of "bad characters" in charge of things.. they came in by droves from the woodwork.. one guy who managed to do quite a bit of damage at the first just "showed up" at one of the campuses. "Well, if you can come up with the money, you can stay.."