Ham

In a weird kinda way.. I felt it was 100 percent bullsheet from day one of my involvement.. the promise of being "family" being only an illusion of sorts.. I think I "went with the flow" so to speak.. path of least resistance, the path that would provide the greatest stability at the time.. does that make sense?

In one of my past lives I think I may have been one of these "skanks".. I think it's partially hidden from me. maybe I had good parents this time around..

and these were a lot of the "counselors" people trusted their lives, family relationships, marriages, child-raising responsibilities, finances and more to.. The thought that I gave any credence to their "professional" opinions and counsel even now makes me sick to my stomach..

the scary thing.. how many of this crowd are off on their own, running a cult, basking in mog worship.. thinking vic's "legacy" to be something to be proud of.. an exclusive heritage. Undoubtedly, some of them were abused as well.. I find it intriguing that many turned to momentus to try to close their wounds.. "kill the victim".. putting their mind on a closed loop of carefully crafted rationalizations..

Why couldn't they just walk away, and let it be.. the older kids were smart. run as fast and as far from new knoxville that one's legs could take them.. Mac probably bought into this nonsense.. well, I wouldn't want to be an enrollee in the program when things go "wrong".. when the little mogster shows he can't live up to being the (grand)son of "gawd"..

took me a minute to get that reference.. heheh. makes me wonder though.. how did that "prophecy" exactly go? That der ministry, or word would live as long as a vierville offspring "stood"? either way, in PRACTICE, it would make those of the *royal* seed a SAVIOR, or SAVIORS, would it not? maybe that's what they mean by "those charged with oversight'.. perhaps they really believe the madman's prophecy. "chosen ones" messiahs all.. In a practical sense, anyway..

I wonder if raising your kid to think he's the messiah could be considered child abuse..

"we KNOW something is wrong with you. You'd better come clean.. spill your guts.. tell us what spirit are you harboring.." I slowly backed away to the door.. "Hmm. I'll have to think about it. Yeah.. think about it, and get back with you.." "Oh. OK.. I don't think they were exactly prepared for that.. I never went back. Now I don't know what kind of impact my departure made.. I have no idea how they spinned it.. I haven't heard from people still in for years..

yeah.. what makes him/them *special*? The real pathetic part of all of this.. the "staff" is our age and older.. you'd think they would know better. Better that is than to attempt to resurrect vic I's dog and pony show.. and bait his young namesake with promises of mogdom and all.. maybe they really think the vicster was the messiah.. I know, not DOCTRINALLY. They'd dismiss that claim in a minute.. but on a practical level, couldn't this be the case? They have an almighty MOG who brought da word like they think it hasn't been known since the primordial fish crawled out of the sea.. all was darkness to them, before 1942.. and his offspring.. MUST be a "holy thing of gawd".. they might as well call him "the lord".. it might be a little more honest..

Oh yeah. They've probably drummed that in his head since he was a tike.. sheesh. I'd say he probably believes it.. that or he's just looking an organization with a few slaves (ahem) volunteers to help fund his way through graduate school.. either way it's troubling to me.. the supposed elders.. there's no excuse to yoke a kid with, in my opinion, this kind of egotism and insanity.. The "promised one" isn't even near THIRTY yet..

and they still have the same lame website.. no information of real relevance. http://sowersonline.com/default.aspx No listing of "officers".. just a single contact through an aol account, and a donate tab at the bottom. The feeling I get looking at that.."here am I, serve me.."

j.p. same program. v2p2's running it, but he's not running it. It's his idea, but not really his idea.. it's run by a board.. pa's on board. Then I hear: it's not jr.'s program, it's really Mc*ullen's.. but then junior tells me he cooked it up.. and that's about all anybody who is not on the "board" knows.. or rather, that's all those on the "board" seem to care that anybody else should know..

and that is the REAL question I asked, personally. "What are you doing to keep the same thing from happening, AGAIN?" No answers of course. Personally, I wouldn't keep someone whom I know who actually gives a damn in the dark.. you asked for help for this thing, didn't you? Prayed for "guidance"? For "wisdom" in running the thing? Here it is.. don't like a little rough edge on it.. tough crap.

you might have something there.. just move the trees out of town, where the squirrels are quite aware that city firearm laws loose their jurisdiction..

words borrowed from Groucho from another thread: I can't find fault with Groucho for this. The corps supposedly signed on to receive training such that they could acquire an in-depth spiritual perception and awareness. Instead, I think they got training which instilled mog worship and beat them down into a lifetime of bondage and servitude.. so how does this new group think they are going to do any better? "any participant may be dismissed at any time.." "the program may be cancelled at any time" all at the whims or discretion of those charged(?) with oversight.. "those in charge" apparently are above guilt, wrongdoing or recrimination. what if abuse occurs? does the victim find themself waking up on a bus with a headache, 700 miles away? And the rest of the enrollees find the person's life picked apart in some kind of spiritual analysis, as to why they got "possessed"? will they be so well "trained" that they will disregard the evidence, seen through their own eyes, and buy the stories of how der mog is the greatest, and can do no wrong? I still don't see how using the same methods will produce any different results..

some people say you can't make a silk purse out of a sows ear. I don't see how people think they can set up some kind of paramilitary survivor program in the middle of the swamp, and BEAT spirituality into the volunteers. Submission and obedience, perhaps.. but "spirituality"? The kid's probably had barely enough psychology courses to be dangerous..

I dunno.. sometimes I think "apologist" is more of an observation, a statement of that which is obvious. Some did it in the old ministry.. some mogster would rip somebody's throat out, and then subordinates would begin making excuses.. he's tired, he's over-worked battling debils, he's just spiritually angry, he's.. on, and on , and on.. never the real obvious answer, "he's just an a**".. maybe they don't know they are doing it.. it's like bad breath.. MOST of the time I think some of the so called name-calling is more of a personal favor, than a personal attack.. but really, how else do you inform someone they are behaving badly, or just giving one grounds of perceiving them as behaving badly? Maybe a nice personal message.. but for some, unsolicited advice is not very welcome..

so, in the old system, why did they prove to be ineffective as to rooting out the evil? Admittedly, some heroically tried.. even at great risk to themselves. I think the overall ineffectiveness marks the system itself as flawed.. the basic tools needed to fix the system itself were lacking or non-existent.

"Acquire and in-depth spiritual perception and awareness.." Do they really think they can deliver on this one? Some of those guys likely were around practically until rosie's reign.. and didn't have a stinking CLUE of the real abuses going on behind the scenes.. starting from gramps, to loy.. where was their highly valued acquired in depth spiritual perception and awareness, then? Can't they see that mog worship kinda clouds one's judgement? I don't think they can discern spirits out of a wet paper bag.. especially as long as they hold gramps in high regard. I think all they are doing, is conditioning people to disregard that which is obvious, and seek out the arcane explanation.. the mini-mogster didn't get a ticket because he was speeding, no. It's debils out there, trying to break his concentration, so da greatness of der verd doesn't prevail..

I dunno. Some people have a desperate need to live in some form of self-delusion. Why not give it to them? Either way it goes, they are "right". One way avoids all the argument..

Please don't quote the troll either. That defeats the purpose of the ignore button. I haven't seen a single quote I haven't seen before. Subtantially the same material, over and over and over.. nothing new. Nothing "newsworthy" enough to bring to the attention of the community. I think all the haranguing just advertises the trolls resolve to endlessly deny, object in a psesudo legal matter, decry the supposed character assasination of hoodlums.. I think it sends the wrong message to those who lurk here, that they WILL be challenged if they share personal experiences. And grilled. And endlessly cross examined.. Some may consider it a little rude, but maybe a few private messages to a newcomer rather than replies to a troll might curtail a lot of this nonsense..

I had a problem with der vey's lack of classification of sins in God's eyes.. that to God, lying is as bad as murder, that there are no grades of sins, but only in society. I think the teaching that the old testament was written for our learning was invoked generally if it was convenient. Adultery? No problemo.. your little "white lie" was just as bad.. besides, we are not under the law. Then on the other hand, they taught that "a believer in the grace administration would not even THINK of doing less than the TITHE." why would a "believer in the age of grace" want to do any less than what the law dictated regarding ADULTERY? I guess one had to be spiritual enough to "handle" flying below the law..

No replies yet? maybe it's TOO cwazy..

The Helsinki Horror

and what do they have to offer the recruits? Power, to be LIKE THEM.. in the ORGANIZATION. to be the "who's who" in the cult hall of shame.. the "privilege" of having the power of summary judgement- to be like God..