lindyhopper

LCM had said that during Da Fog he had gotten so depressed and low that he had thought about suicide...or that he had been under attack from "suiside spirits" --> Maybe twi leaders saw his condition when he was given the boot, knew his mental problems, and didn't what him to commit suiside and make the whole thing blow up even worse. So they put him under supervision at a his Doc's house to make sure. All speculation of course. But a posibility. Thanks for the info Paw. OK then...Who's your mommy?

BTW... I don't sweat whether or not my involvement was good or bad. I am what I am. Yes, in part because of twi. The good with the bad. Aren't we all that way? I just move ahead trying to make myself better. We could analyze our everyday actions and see how they adversely affect other people throughout the world and see that we are very "evil". We would probably be paralized by guilt knowing how the gas I use or the diamond i gave my wife negatively affects people in the world. We could do the same and see a lot of good as well. Kind of a Yin-yang sort of thing. There is not one without the other. OK then...Who's your mommy?

Kind of not. OK then...Who's your mommy?

oldies.... Were we supposed to really think about that questoin? because when you really think about it, you get some interesting answers. God's "masterpieces", us humans, throughout history have done more evil than imaginable and he knew we would from the beginning (whenever that was) before he made us. Kind of interesting. OK then...Who's your mommy?

Hey Kevlar, yes it was. have you been there? OK then...Who's your mommy?

Here I am. Thanks all. :D--> It was a good day. For me. Ate at a restaurant overlooking the harbor that night. The moon made it all the more beautiful. Unfortunately, only a mile away was where a water taxi had capsized earlier that day during a strong storm. They were still looking for ten missing passengers as we ate. Two had already died. As of today they recovered all but three, meaning that five died in the tragidy. :(--> Made us feel a little guilty sitting there sipping our wine at one of the nicest seafood restaurants in town. But it reminded us how lucky (?) we are and how prescious life, family and friends are. Thanks again to all you lovely, generous virtual friends. OK then...Who's your mommy? [This message was edited by lindyhopper on March 11, 2004 at 23:42.]

Today is a full moon and my birthday. I am ready for the transformation to begin. OK then...Who's your mommy?

yeah Click-n I remember Dominic Ross but not from Maryland. He left right before I got here. I don't remember if is was from him being in F11 or other Family junior corps or just from mutual friends or what. But I remember he was a cool guy. How do/did you know him? OK then...Who's your mommy?

I still have a trunk that M*g Ki*H gave me that was from her witch days in college. I'd better get rid of it...it might me a dog wistle for debil spirits. OK then...Who's your mommy?

I never heard of anyone praying for bad things to happen to "copped out" folks. Not from locals or from leadership. They did use negative examples, like DM did at that ROA or like Loy did by saying we would be greasespots by midnight or like VPW did by saying you walk out from under God's umbrella. The praying for bad things to happen to others sounds like local wack-jobs. I by no means am a twi defender, but this sounds strange to me. I mostly hung out with corps types and corps kids and upper level wayfers and my many local area beleafers, so by all means, I could be wrong. CoolioWaters, Interesting what you said about "magical thinking". I would agree. Words are just words are just words. Descriptions that we use by picking and choosing. I does boil down to the same thing....power in the invisible....through words....let there be light and so on from there. Nice observation. OK then...Who's your mommy?

yeah, rascal, I actually think I remember it being said that we should becareful in public, because of the way the 'stupid world' viewed child abuse. OK then...Who's your mommy?

Thank you mandii, that was very true with a beautiful ending. Ex, I was locked out because I changed my email on my profile but accidentally deleted the line for my registration email, an address I no longer had. So GS registered me and I couldn't post until I realized I needed to re-re-register with the newer address. I know it’s confusing. Anyway choo chooo Speaking of "raising a finger".... I also remember having a wooden spoon broken over my knee when I raised it to block the blow. Of course a fresh one was never far, so they just went and got another one and held my leg down so they could get me good. "raising a finger" just doesn't seem to do it justice, OM. I experienced not only experienced these things but saw much more. Like it or not there was child abuse not only happening in twi but it was taught by the leadership. I was in a corps family and know what was taught and saw it carried out. I saw every adult in the child day care program watching over 6 year olds and under, not only carry wooden spoons but hit those little ones rather hard. Enough to not just make them cry out of shock but out of pain. Hell, I, as a middle-schooler, cried out of pain from it at times. These were the future leaders of the ministry. Is it logical to think that the F11, F12, F13 (84-87ish) that I was in contact with were the only ones abusing this rule of the "rod of correction"? Not really. It happened in every corps, my friend. They then went out on the field and taught the locals that were just waiting to do everything their leaders said to do. These are not stories that have been warped and exaggerated over time. I was in twi from the age of 5 to the age of 25, and I saw it the whole way thru, tapering off a little towards the end. The teaching publicly only began to get a little better at a Rock one year where they publicly said the rod was used to get the kids attention, not beat them. This was in the late 80s or early 90's. Why after, what 40 years, did we need such clarification? Because things were out of hand to the point that the ministry was getting a bad image and was being "blamed" (and we don't want that now do we). But the abuses continued and probably continue to different degrees. By the way... I've got a finger to raise for ya. OK then...Who's your mommy?

Been locked out for a while, but I thought I would add my two bits for the record and for those that doubt. My personal abuse stories may not have been hospital worthy, but they have left an impression in my mind for life and on my rear for days at times. The physical abuse stories are also stories that my mother would probably reply with "Don't be a wuss!" but anyway...I think I have posted them here before separately...but here they are. Being hit with a bible across the face from the full swing of an adult man, knocking me backwards out of my chair. Then he tried to pray for me and reproved me for not automatically letting him. This was in the corps, in front of other 4th thru 6th graders...taught us all a lesson. It was brought on because I forgot my bible. When I was asked wear it was I was in my room. When asked why I said, "well, because I forgot". So he gave me his...upside the head. You can see I obviously deserved it. Another time, in the family corps, another adult was collecting basketballs and everyone was throwing them to him. I threw mind from his right and yelled his name. I mistakenly hit him in the head or shoulder. Before I could apologize, he threw it back at my head only with much more force, hitting me square in the face. He also showed no remorse and reproved me. Numerous other times I was lifted of the ground by an open hand hit to the rear or bruised be a spoon. All done by people other than my parents. You see in the corps everyone was your parent and you were to view them that way. If you didn't you were "taught" to. The most hurtful abuse had to do with mental pressure and mental abuse into "confessing" about a preWAY sexual abuse. It was mentally beaten out of me using fear of being M&A, fear of losing my family because of that, losing everyone I cared about because of that, fear of being labeled a homo and under devil spirit influence, fear of lying to leadership, fear of disappointing God almighty. No pressure. If I had a nickel for every time I heard a leader say that while divisively getting what they wanted out of people, I'd be a rich man. OK then...Who's your mommy?

My fellow Hopper... I had not heard that you were out! Congratulations! Just a dream now.....ain't that nice? OK then...Who's your mommy?

LOL ex and Pmosh ex that is what I was going to say. ---------------------- "WOW, Pigs do fly....I believe!" OK then...Who's your mommy?

Probably the biggest problem is that people watch TV every night, all night, no matter what is on. A bigger and sadder evil... the fathers being total idiotic throwbacks is probably more reality TV than any show claiming to be. OK then...Who's your mommy?

Wichita WOWs of 92-93 I knew a number of them. Chris Lacy being one of them, I believe. I know a number of the girls went into the corpes later. I know Chris is out, still wondering what she is up to. I also would like to know waht happened to the rest of them. There was a Amy ____ I think. What happened to you kids. OK then...Who's your mommy?

I was reading the interview with Roger Roggeman on Excultworld, and he reffered to a young lady he knew who was in a cult. When asked how far she would have gone for this cult, she replied"?if they had asked me to hurt someone or to kill somebody, I probably would have". Now it would be shocking to me to think that anyone in TWI would have sone something like this...but who knows. Can anyone here honestly say that they probably would have killed if they were asked to by TWI leaders? I know I wouldn't, but then I had a hard time just reading and listening to everything they told me to. lol Anyone? OK then...Who's your mommy?

would love to, better off, but don't think it will happen anytime soon. Closest we're coming is Atlanta in March. Who's your daddy?

Moony... They were in my family's fellowship from the time they arrived or witnessed to (don't remember which it was) untill I left in 93' How long ago were you there? Who's your daddy?

Hey Jar I seem to remember a young lady that went to school (I think) in Inianapolis and stayed. Can't quite place the name though...from Chicago....the Rev. Mrs. Lally was her aunt....I would guess she left when they left. Also a Shawn/Sean Pluncket (sp?)lived there. Any of you know who I am talking about. Who's your daddy?

Tried it before Lightside. Also know a little about the brain. It functions faster than you can percieve. It is not possible to have two of the same thoughts at the same time. Plus as Mike said, even "silently" talking to yourself causes small muscle movements in the throat and mouth. What you are probably doing is waht I used to do. It was not saying something at the same time...(SIT and with understanding)...it is alternating speach at a rate that is barely noticable to you. There are breaks in normal speach patterns and it takes our brains very very little time to think of a word or sentence. Much faster than you can speak it. That alone allows all kinds of time for you (and your brain...as if they are different) to SIT in yor head and to pray normaly at the "same time". Not to mention the fact that you don't have to think about the "words" you are saying when you SIT you just make the sounds. Kind of like Scat. Ever do that you Beatniks? Very similar, kind of like singing in tounges. Who's your daddy?

Hey, Roy, you have a sense of humor! That was funny. LOL Are you going to have to go Insurgent? I always like the Chicago site more than Dallas. Many more local restaurants etc. It was nice finally having the chance to spend time with my innie corps brother and fam. So nice of them to bring this back for you "committed". ;)--> later Who's your daddy?

I'm sorry I disagree. and Wolf, I'm kidding. Who's your daddy?

I have a problem with short-term memory. Who's your daddy?