Nottawayfer

What was the Alaska fiasco? I don't know about this.

Man oh man, does that bring a memory to me. Remember that stupid "Believer's Family Class"? Remember Martinpuke teaching that it is OK for single people to get laid once they get "of age" and aren't married? Well, I struggled with that for a long time being a divorced 30-something woman. I sat through that damn class scratchin my head. I talked to my TC who didn't have the balls to say "He is wrong" nor would they back up the damn teaching. As a matter of fact they told me if I brought someone home for that purpose, they would be upset. The TC just said "I don't know; talk to the BC." The BC's wife openly promoted going out and getting laid by whomever you pleased. Talk about confusion. This woman said that most of the problems in her fellowship were due to people not getting laid.... --> Can you say dysfunction???

JT: Were any of the instances you refer to against the law? Should someone have gone to jail because of their acts? Were you told to look the other way when something was immoral or illegal?

On another thread, someone mentioned a heinous act committed against some believers. They were counseled by twi leadership not to press charges because it would make twi look bad. I am more than shocked to see that people in twi are not as important as the surface reputation of twi. It is sickening. How many other instances do we know about where leadership counseled people in error like this? It obviously is all for the glory of twi. Remeber the BS line "that the ministry be not blamed"?

I think if ole VeePee had lived his life more honestly and apologized for his bad things WHEN HE WAS ALIVE, there wouldn't be a reason for him to have to respond. He chose to be in the limelight. He made himself the MOG. He liked it. He hurt some people really bad. Because he didn't take care of this business before he died, here we are talking about his bads. I would like to hope that I don't leave this world in such a bad manner.

Trolls? That's quite harsh to say. I don't think the intent of the starting of this thread was bad. It turned bad though. I think people read way too much in to things and then speak way too much. I never once took the intent of this thread to be a finger-pointing session. I took it as something to think about or blow off. That's all. I don't think forgiveness is a requirement to be godly or righteous. I think it does, however, benefit the forgiver a lot. I know from personal experience. It may not be that way for someone else though. I do not think that to forgive requires the offender to apologize. But if someone feels that way, let them. We are all different. Hell, we are not waybots anymore. I would think that because we came from a cult where there was no tolerance of difference that we would be more flexible to accept difference (especially in opinions) without namecalling and disrespect. Obviously forgiveness means something different to each of us. We all give or don't give it for various reasons.

Oh...making memories...that is awesome Rascal! Your kids will always remember the good times they had with you, and that is irreplaceable. I love the quote someone gave from Erma Bombeck. I just hope when I have kids that I will relax and enjoy them. That will be my goal. I'll just have to get some slippers to wear instead of going barefoot.... :D--> OR hubby can clean the floor! He would do it in a heartbeat! I love that about him! And he wouldn't say a word or have a bad thought about doing it.

I used to be the BIGGEST neat freak. I developed this habit before twi because I didn't think my mom kept a clean enough house. I would be embarrassed if someone came over and saw a messy house. I think it was engrained from my grandma. She was a spic an span kind of lady--house just right, excellent cook, great hostess. I admired her for all of that. Joining twi just augmented that mentality for me in an extremely anal way. I remember living with a couple who were my TCs. She was a stay-home mom who was messy as all getup. She would clean and I would go back over things after her....I used to get reproved for that. But my pet peeve is seeing "crap" on the kitchen floor. I like to walk barefoot and NOT feel anything on my feet. It totally grosses me out. The worst for me though was when I was on staff. Our rooms in Founders Hall were open to the world. We had no locks. I always feared that the man of gawd would come looking in my room to determine how spiritual I was. I made all kinds of judgments on people while I was there based simply how their rooms looked. Why wouldn't I expect someone to do it to me? It's a sick, sick thought process. And I still work my brain when I am in a dirty, smelly, or messy house. I constantly have to remind myself that there are no devil spirits lurking in the corners..... --> Were we hoodwinked or what??

I think a common thing I see in the responses of people who forgave others who didn't ask for it is that the forgiver did it to help themselves move on. I know it helps. Does the offender deserve forgiveness? Probably not. I remember seeing things on TV of family members of murder victims and those raped forgiving the offenders. I never understood it then, but I do now. While still in twi, I never considered forgiveness an option until the offender asked for it. When I left twi, I had emotionally overwhelming feelings that I needed to get resolved or I would end up crazy or sick or both. If I were to see a twi leader today, I don't know that I would even acknowledge their presence much less tell them they hurt me because it just doesn't matter to me anymore. I guess I could say I'm leaving it in God's hands. I know that He will make things right. And I'm OK with with that. Until then, I will do all I can to warn people about twi. They deserve to know what it's REALLY about.

Just thought I'd let you know she's still definitely in and on staff and twi hq. She answers the phone in switchboard.

I did the internet dating thing. I really liked it. I met my hubby on the internet. My sister met her's on the internet, and my best friend met her boyfriend on it too. You just have to have a big BS meter in order to be able to do it well. Always listen to what people say to you and match it up with things they say later. If things aren't consistent, then bail. A lot of men will use the internet to get laid, and that's all they want. I had only one bad incident in my internet dating. This guy and I meet for coffee. We have a great time talking and getting to know each other. He then says let's get out of here and go to my place. He played guitar, so I said yes against "my" rules. When we got there, he was good for about an hour, but then he wanted to kiss me. I asked him what he expected beyond that, and he said nothing. So I kissed him. He got frustrated and ended up telling me if I wasn't planning on having sex with him that it wouldn't work out. So I left. His loss. He lied and he was an arsehole. I ALWAYS kept my cell phone with me. I told my friend or my sister where I was going, who I was with, what their number was, their info from the internet site. And I had them call me in the middle of the date to check on me. I also told them I would call them once I got home, and if I didn't call to get me some help. NEVER have someone come to your house or go to their house until you have seen them at least a few times. It's always been a bad scenario. If a guy bitches or complains about an ex wife or ex girlfriend, take it as a sign. Don't go there. This is a big one to remember. Meet friends and family members if you can. It will tell you a lot about the person you are dating. My husband's co-workers praised him, and they were right... ;)-->

LOLOL Chas! I worked in FS during an Advanced Class. I remember breaking a glass creamer which was supposed to be on the Head Table! Lord oh mighty! You'd thought the place burned down or sumthin! Gawd forbid, don't EVER cut your finger in FS.

Quote my MJ: That is some patience.

Ex, The pictures change as you move your mouse over different areas of the page.

Well I'll be an SOB. That's why it took almost a week to get my halogen light changed in my room in FH. No kiddin'.

There are about 20 who work in the bookstore, and actually printing has about 15, and you forgot word processing. It has about 10 or so in that dept. Food services and grounds has way more than originally estimated. When I was on staff, there were about 300. It was still grossly too many for the work that actually needed to be done. Some departments had wayyyy too much work because of the anality of the job (i.e., grounds), and others had too little work. Multi services has more than 4 too.

Rascal, I understand how you feel. I have respect for you and your opinions. I would like to bring a point up, and I want you to know that my intentions are not to convince you against your will. I forgave twi. I know that I will NEVER receive an apology from them. For me, it was gettng rid of the rage and anger that came every time I thought of what those arseholes did to many pure-hearted people. That rage consumed me for months when I first left twi. Venting and getting it out on these forums helped a lot, but I still had contempt and hate for a lot of twi leaders. I wanted to get to the point that these jerks didn't affect my emotions like they did. It was a real problem for me. Once I decided I forgave them, it really released a lot of "toxins" FROM ME. It was for me to be able to move on and remember again what God did for me. I NEVER excused twi's actions. I will NEVER trust them again even if they go on national TV and announce that they hurt many and apologized and offered large sums of money to repay for the hurt they caused many (like that's ever gonna happen. -->) Forgiveness is for the forgiver too. It helps us move on and not think so much about others' wrongs which cause us ill feelings. I was very skeptical of this when it was first brought up to me, but it really has lightened my load a lot since doing it.

The Panarellos left before the rehashed AC-not-so-spayshul in 2002. I was there and didn't see them at all. A friend of mine had visited me from hq in the spring of 2002 and had mentioned they had left.

Uhhh HillsBro...do you have an obsession with doggy doo? I was on your other thread, and ......then to see it again here....well, isn't that spayshul.

No way in hell....I can't put anything gross in my mouth. Just watching Stiffler on "American Wedding" eat that dog crap made me green and ready to barf. I don't watch Fear Factor for that reason either. Too gross......

I never had breathing problems ever until I moved to Arizona this year. I haven't been diagnosed with asthma yet, but all the symtoms point toward it. The stupid doctors just prescribe their pat answers and send you on your way. I am still looking for a decent doctor. I can't breathe a lot of times and hack and cough the rest of the time. I've been to the doctor umpteen times and to urgent care and the emergency room in the past month. I've been told that Arizona is not a good area for asthmatics. The air in northwestern Arizona is dry and dusty. The crap flying around in the air is horrible. My aunt was an asthmatic and moved to Arizona about 25 years ago, and she had to leave because it made it worse. My sister moved to Arizona about 15 years ago and had to leave within 6 months because of developing asthma. She had never had breathing problems before moving. She was told she was allergic to the Arizona desert. She had many nights in the hospital. I sympathize with those who have troubles breathing. I always took breathing for granted until this month.

I like early voting. I work for my county now, so I just walked over to voter registration on my break and voted. It was the most convenient way I've ever voted.

It's their denial to put Jesus where he needs to be that gives them their bs doctrine of the "absent Christ." They don't get it, never will get it, and will always be in the dark. Just go there and try to say Jesus without adding Christ.....

Belle, I went to a church which studied that book for awhile, but we didn't listen to videos of the guy who wrote the book. I think a video would have kept me from being involved. I made a pact to NEVER sit through a Bible class again. We just heard bits and pieces of the book at a sermon and then our small groups tracked with the reading from that week. We talked at our small groups, but only if we wanted to. We had a larger groups of about 13 women, so if someone decided not to talk it wasn't noticed too much. A group of 4 would make it a little more noticeable. I was glad I read the book. It didn't remind me of twi at all, but I didn't retain it like I did the many times I took pfal and wap. I don't feel the need to ever do that again. It was really just about fellowship for me. I did wait awhile before I found a church I liked. When I first left twi I went to a lot of offshoots of twi. They all made me ill and reminded me too much of twi. I realized I didn't want twi. So then I went to a few churches. I wasn't ready to go to church so I took a rest for awhile. When I was ready, the exact church I needed was right there. I got a lot of healing from my twi experience at that church in a divorce care group. I didn't expect that at all, but leaving twi was like a divorce for me because I put more trust in that organization than I ever did in anything until now. As you know, I recently got married and moved to another state. We went to the church my husband was involved with. The pastor at that church grated on me, and he made some inappropriate comments about one of our friends who used to go to our church. We quit going because of his attitude and told him so. He apologized for hurting our feelings....sounds so much like twi leadership. So you can't always escape bs like we saw in twi, but you don't have to stay around. We see this pastor in shopping a lot (small town), but I just smile, say hi and move on. I think the big thing for me is to realize that nothing is perfect. Coming from twi that was a hard pill to swollow because I thought twi was perfect for at least 2/3 or the 20 years I was involved in it. Just be where you are the happiest. ;)-->

I forgave twi and anyone who ever hurt me even if thought none asked for it. Why? Because I needed to move and not live in a state of rage because of the bs I endured in that organization. It does not mean that I trust them again or even respect them again. As a matter of fact, they are probably close, if not at the end, of my list of respect and trust. It does not mean that the wrongs they did are OK now, but it does mean that I can move on from ill feelings which cause rage in my heart. I think this whole idea of forgiveness requires someone to ask you for it first is another BS teaching from twi. We must put ourselves above their rancid doctrines and live a higher level of love.