J0nny Ling0

So, there are drugging rapists here at GSC who need to apologize. And if they are here, as you say, then they need not only apologize, but be arrested also...

Bravo Rocky! :)

I agree with you both LZ and Eyes. I was wrong and misread it. Sorry Excathedra, my apologies to you. And no doubt, it was the kind and loving people that attracted me to The Way fore shore. And hey you, DWBH! Too bad my avatar doesn't stick it's tongue out like yours does! Oh, here: :P

Now. This is an amazing thing. Do you know, Excathedra how things here would go down if I were to say to you the same thing, as in this manner?: If I were to say that to you, I think that Pawtucket just might kick me out for that. Okay, so you think I am on a path of destruction. I will just say that I hope you have a nice day! Mmwwaahh! :)

Sorry you had to go through that Twink. I know it was a very weird time for my friends at that time. We did make the best of it though, and had some fun also.

If you know that rapes are occurring within TWI, I think that we could all agree that the Police need to be informed. I am not sure if adultery or fornication is illegal or not, but rape most certainly is! If you know that this is going on, then I think that talking about it here and not trying to do something about it there is terribly irresponsible! By all means, get the authorities involved! Seriously, take the knowledge of the particular victim(s?) that you know about, as well as the particular perpetrator(s) name(s) and get the authorities involved. Hell, I just read the book "Deliverance" and the rape scene in the book was so heinous that I wanted to jump into the book and shoot the perps! If you know of rapes going on then by all means, help stop it.

I don't know if I was ever marked and avoided. Do any of you, who stayed with The Way after 1989 know? Many of you hung in there and rabidly persecuted people like me. I am Kevin Nye, 10th Corps, ex Way clergy. Did you mark me and avoid me? Never heard if I was. I do know that They probably had reason to mark me and avoid me, for, I ran a "safe house" for International Corps who had to leave because Craig kicked them out and off of HQ grounds with less than a 24 hour notice. I had New Zealander's, Aussies, a Greek guy, and some Americans holed up in my home in Maryland because they had no place to go. I helped them escape the rabid, wicked, and evil persecution that they endured simply because like me, they decided to think and make their own decisions, instead of act like fearful automatons and stay "In". I had Larry Panarello and his punk foot minions in the DC area trying to break up my marriage and infiltrate my home when I wasn't there, because they knew I was "reactionary". I tried to, and successfully, helped my International friends escape the intolerable scene that they found themselves in. I got them jobs, helped them get up the money to fly back to their Home Countries, gave them a place to lay their heads, fed them, and all the while not only trying to help them make sense of it all, but also struggling in my own heart and mind to try and make sense of it all. All the while trying to be a Husband and Dad, and trying to help my wife try to make sense of it all. So, was I on that list of "Mark and Avoid"? Was I? Did any of you here know if I was on that list? I bailed when it was so obvious that things were way WRONG. Did any of you who stayed for many many more years ever notice my name on that list? If I was on that list, no doubt those actions had something to do with it...

Okay Ms. Jesus. You go girl.

NaughtyGrrl! What a sweet heart you are! And such a fine looking dog too! My wife and I are both dog lovers, although, right now we have a German Wire Hair Pointer (GWP) pup, and have never had a Rottweiller. I have certainly known a few fine Rotties though, and I have really liked 'em. Well, have a great day! JL

Why thank you Sunesis, and please forgive me for being mis-leading in that you weren't actually in my first twig, but were a part of that whole experience being a WOW in one of the other twigs. You know what I mean, but I did want to be more accurate here...

"Was personal background a contributing factor?" Well, Yes, and No. If you are asking if my personal background allowed me to succumb to a "mind stealing cult", then the answer is a resounding NO. But, if you are asking if my personal background, which included a huge hunger for the Truth of God's Word, then the answer is a resounding Yes. I found out more about my Lord Jesus Christ in the first few months of involvement with The Way than I ever dreamed would come my way. AND, I found FELLOWSHIP with wonderful and loving people on the twig level who outright helped to save my life from the destructive path that I was on. Dang I loved and still LOVE those folks from my first twig. One of them hangs out here on a regular basis, and she was pure sunshine to me. I won't mention her name, but that Sunesis was and is a bright beam of God's sunlight...

Very nice perspective SOTM :)

No, but he did eventually become the vice president of The Way under Rosalie Riverbark, the "I Can Do Person....."

Yeah....Old Harvey was a neat guy back in high school and in our first twig. Very kind hearted and giving. Funny, we used to call him "Old Harvey", or, at least me and a couple others did. I guess when he began to move on up the pipeline, he requested that he be called "Harve". But, I never did, just cuz, I guess. Maybe one day he'll leave too...

People should fully warned about The Way and their dishonesty today as an on going cult. No doubt about it. The dishonesty and idolatry rampant within it, all over it, and promoted by it, is simply devilish. But for me, holding a grudge about a past wrong toward me is not productive. But that's just me. But by all means, warn others of the phony baloney that The Way is. I'd like to see some of my old friends "still in" finally come to their senses and wake the hell up and just leave. But, I think old Harvey P, my old neighborhood friend, is hopelessly stuck and hanging on while still hurting people with his false doctrine and legalistic crapola...

Yes. Yes. Then that is your choice. But I forgive you Rascal. But I hardly think that this should now bar me from discussion on a topic such as forgiveness, or any other topic for that matter just because you are in that discussion as well. And if my perspective runs at odds with yours, then I guess you might perceive it as me "not forgiving you", or view it as me "persecuting you", but that will be your choice Ispose. I have been instructed in the Scriptures to speak God's Word, and forgiveness is a huge topic when it comes to our Lord Jesus Christ and when dealing with other Humans. But just like I said before, forgiving someone is not the same as "giving them a pass", a stamp of approval on their actions. I don't always do that (speak God's Word), but I have the right to do that, and on this topic here, I think that forgiving those who have trespassed against us in The Way is completely in order. You do not think that. Fine, don't think it. That is your privilege. The guy who started this thread wanted input, and I commented in it. By the way, he sent me a very nice comment, thanking me for my perspective. He is a younger fella, grew up in The Way.

What did DWBH share here? Who is she anyway? And, I would like to go on record that I have no problem that people here say what they know about what the "MOGs" did. (That term just flat cracks me up!) What I do resent is that some people here seem intent on proving that there was absolutely nothing good at all in The Way at any time ever, and that all who were involved were deceived mindless robots, and that God had nothing to do with it, and that any and all of the time spent there was a complete waste of a Life. And for the record, I do not fellowship with any group these days, Splinter, Church, Synagogue, or Mosque. But I am very thankful for many many things I learned in The Way and in The Way Corps and keep those good things with me. I learned to work honestly and hard as in the work ethic, I learned public speaking which I enjoy, I learned to write and was inspired to do so when I wrote my research paper (which was really lousy and stupid too-but it did inspire me to continue in writing), and I learned a lot about the Bible. And of course I met within The Way some of the greatest people on the Planet. And some of the funniest too! Oh the times we had in Alaska when certain leaders would come up to teach the Bible! It was an outright blast! But, when mentioning these things in the past here, I was told by certain people that I was just "sophomoric" and having a spirited good time at the expense and destruction of others' lives, blah blah blah. Or that "those things that I learned could have been learned anywhere". Now, that last statement is true in a large way. BUT, I didn't learn them "anywhere". I learned them in The Way. I had gotten on my knees one time and prayed to God to please send a Christian person to me to tell me out Jesus Christ. And, the very NEXT DAY, a sweet gal from New York, a WOW, came to work on my restaurant boat as a cocktail waitress. And, as I said before, she opened God's Word to me. Her very presence was witness enough for me. I prayed, He answered. So what was that, a cruel joke on an 18 year old kid by the Lord God Almighty? I will never be convinced that it was, and I will never be convinced that I wasted my youth like some here have declared. It is my opinion from what I have seen and when I was involved, that VP started out good, went way bad and hurt a good number of people. This is terrible. It is a travesty. But I believe (getting back to the thread here) that it is in the best interest to forgive those who have trespassed against us which enables we humans to let go of the anger and bitterness. To forgive is not to "offer a pass" to the offender. To forgive seems that it mostly offers relief for the one trespassed against, not relief for the trespassER. God Almighty will deal with the trespassER. That's His job, not ours. If the TrespassERS are alive, then sure, expose them. If they are dead, and your incident with them is long since over with, then forgive and try to fuggedaboudit...

Yeah Jeff, I have always believed that TWI started out with good intentions, God's intentions, but then went bad. That VPW got sucked into the pleasures of sin at the expense of innocent people. You see, I had prayed on my knees one night for God to send a Christian to me to teach me what I needed to know. And the very next morning, God sent a WOW Ambassador, a girl, who glowed with the love of God who then, on the spot opened up the book of Ephesians to me and taught me a bunch about Jesus Christ, many of our son ship rights and etc. An undeniable answer to prayer! . So, if God saw fit to introduce me to The Way Ministry and PFAL, then it was good enough for me too. I know things went bad, but I too believe that things started out "good". Even better than good, but went bad... :)

Oldies. It is a "look". For instance, one day, I saw Craig looking off into the clouds over Camp Gunnison. He had the most peaceful "look" on his face, that I just knew he was manifesting the "fruit of the spirit" known as "peace". Another time, he was explaining to my wife something about his Grandma, and they got into the whole "lineage" thing concerning Craig's family. And, because the whole "family tree thing" can be very confusing, he was very patient with my wife (his long ago friend from Oklahoma), which showed me that Craig was at that moment manifesting the fruit of the spirit known as "long suffering" (patience). BUT, not really. And on another side of a ridiculous coin, it's very simple, really. All one has to do with judging another person's soul is just "guess" what is going on in their heart in order to determine whether or not that person will die the eternal death or be given entrance into Eternal Life. It doesn't matter that only God knows what is really in the heart of a man or a woman, all we have to do is look at their works, and if bad, and then simply judge them! Yeah, that's the ticket! And then, go around telling everyone that they are in fact going to die "The Death", because you have placed your eternal; death sentence upon them! My God, this is so ridiculous that it is unbelievable. The TRUTH is, NO ONE REALLY KNOWS the motive of a man or woman but God Almighty! Good works in a person's life may bear good fruit! Bad works in a person's life may bear bad fruit! Good works with out the love of God may very well bear some damn fine good looking fruit, but only God will know the motive behind the works. Shoot, there are all kinds of combinations, but God, the Father Of Lights, is the only one who can really judge Personally, I would rather forgive as Jesus has so obviously told us to do, and leave the HEAVY JUDGING to God Almighty, the ONLY one who can rightfully judge a man or a woman's heart. And if I am wrong for forgiving someone who will be sentenced to die the Second Death, than I would rather err on the side of kindness, compassion, and forgiveness. And don't mistake my saying that for giving the person's actions a "pass". I didn't say give them a pass. If they did wrong, as VPW did in fact do wrong, then their actions should not be "swept under the rug" so to speak. In fact, others should be warned (unless of course the guy is ow dead). But, it is better to forgive and love than it is to hate and be angry over long ago actions by a man who is now dead and not able to come back and apologize. (it was hard to stay away)

You a real piece of work Rascal. Enjoy your bitter pill I guess...

I'm done here. If I come back in two years, I'll probably see the same old same old all over again... :yawn1:

They can't come to your door. They are DEAD. So, waddya gonna do? There is only one thing you can do, if you want to emulate Jesus. Forgive 'em... He told them, present tense, to "depart from him, etc". While they were alive, they had a chance to repent. Maybe some did, most likely some didn't. So, what happens to them later? Dunno. God's business I guess. But, you cannot dismiss Jesus' plea from the cross to forgive them. If Jesus did the Father's Will all of the time, then there must be something here where God's forgiveness and Jesus judgment do not run at odds. The recurring theme of "forgiving our enemies" runs through out the NT. Even Romans 12 says; "If thine enemy hunger, feed him. If he thirsts, give him to drink. For in so doing, thou shalt heap coals of fire upon his head. Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good." (paraphrased from memory) Being kind and forgiving to those who persecute us has marvelous impact. And so, even though this scripture admonishes us in how to deal with "enemies in the present", it can only be that our enemies who are DEAD should be forgiven. Leave 'em where they lay! They'll have to deal with The Almighty His own dang self, and that in itself is way too heavy to even think of! And, I am sure that you would rather have me judging you for things you did to me as opposed to vice versa, for, I would forgive your trespasses against me, although I suppose you would not forgive me. You'd probably just want to cut my nuts off. But, that's the difference between me and you, Rascal...

I don't care about VP's message. JESUS's message is that we are to love and FORGIVE. Jesus forgave men who had him murdered, who mocked him, who spit in his face, who wrapped a robe on his bloody shoulders and let it dry and then ripped it off of him in agony. He endured a Crown Of Thorns that was pounded into his skull, as well as huge nails pounded through his hands and his feet. And he hung there in agony, humiliated and completely betrayed by his best friends, Peter, James, John, Judas, and all of the rest. And yet he forgave. He forgave those who thought that they knew what they were doing. And, he told us, as in a Commandment that we are to forgive those who "trespass against us". We cannot expect an apology from Dead Men, for they are DEAD. But we who are still living, can forgive those who have trespassed against us. We can be better than those who have passed on and never saw the light on forgiveness, because we are alive and can still decide to make right decisions.. Have any of us gone through this type of humiliation? NO. None of us have. He is the ensample, the template, the one who endured, showing us that we too can endure Life's Persecutions, Life's pitfalls, traps and snares. He it is who said "forgive them Father, for they know not what they do". Oh, VP knew what he was doing, just as Pilate knew what he was doing. They both thought that they were in the right, doing what was "really okay". But they were wrong. And Jesus our lord asked The Lord God Almighty to forgive them, for they were in THE DARK Man! They didn't REALLY know what the hell they were doing! And so, we should follow in Jesus' footsteps...

Umm, the messenger was/is Jesus, not VPW. Jesus forgave those who crucified him, and the majority did not apologize nor ask Jesus to forgive them before he did in fact forgive them. A few did, but not all by a long shot. He forgave those who "cast the same into his teeth". That's biblical. I had read and seen that LONG before I ever became involved with The Way. Believe what you want I guess, but thankfully, God and Jesus Christ are far more forgiving than many humans are on this here earth. Once again, glad God and Jesus are the ones in charge. Bitterness eats like a cancer, and the white dove of Holy Spirit has no bitterness...

Thanks White Dove. It's great to know that our Lord Jesus loves us so unconditionally huh? Glad he's The Man, and not us! :)