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How presumptuous of "them." "Our days are too precious to squander on the negatives." "Thank God, Paul did not spend time engaging in word battles about concerns that were decades old." First of all, they have NO idea how I (we) have spent our days (years) since exiting twi. Some here, left around 1987......others of us in the 1990s, and some left around 2008. Ten years, twenty years, thirty years..........they have NO clue as to what we've done to rebuild our lives, help our families, ministered to others, and helped our communities. THEY LIVE IN A BOX..... a box that wierwille built. They think that "living the Word" is regurgitating stolen pfal material at every meeting and doing those deadpan manifestations. They have accepted wierwille's deceptive lies........WITHOUT a thorough, critical examination of them from a-z. And yet, they scoff at those of us who do. Of course, they balk at our time spent here at GSC........ we've called them out for their hypocrisy, arrogance and manner of life. Some of them have spent 45-50 years in a cult ....... and refuse to come clean. So, they hide. They hide by mocking our "word battles." They hide by staying in the shadows. They hide by silence. So now....... they attempt to re-build (cough, cough) ANOTHER cult in the image of the mother cult. Same structure, same centralization, same teachings, same manifestations, etc...... only this time it will be genuine. LOL. What's that Einstein meaning of insanity? Doing the SAME THING over and over expecting different results. Moneyhands, Forts, Horneys......... ALL ex-corpse coordinators who were in charge of the clone factories, ie the corps "training." Sheesh. What a damn, pathetic ploy it was..... and they played right into it. If they had an ounce of critical thinking, then they'd realize that we are speaking the truth here at GSC. They have wasted DECADES trying to mimic the wizard behind the curtain......and smirk at those of us who've engaged in real, honest discussions to undo the burdens and set the captives free. How presumptuous of them to define how I spend my time. Heck, after this post......I will spend the rest of my day doing other things!! They know not of what they speak. And notice, that only that certain "designators" of THEIR group will respond to your questions. What a pathetic, defensive response to your questions. They will not engage, because it amplifies THEIR decades of cult-servitude that does not, and did not, honor God. That's why they put up a shield of defense. Maybe they'll figure it out some day.......or maybe they won't.

The irony in R&R's response is that this is the exact response that Rosie and the Board of Pharisees had to their R&R letter they circulated around a year ago trying to drum up sympathy for. Then they (The Way) marked and avoided the letter senders. More current clear literal evidence that R&R acts currently how they were trained for decades. But hey I'm sure they don't care what we think. All they really need is a group of dolts so they can form their own "Board of Dolts". And skyrider and DWBH - yeah pretty much. Your recent posts express much of my viewpoint as well.

"Please don't waste another moment worrying about that random [person] (me) you met years ago. Our days are too precious to squander on the negatives. I hold no ill will against anyone and I pray that someday you may feel the same."" So, show up, listen to the teaching, bring new people, and don't be stingy whenever the collection plate comes around, and stop questioning whether or not I'm qualified to do it right after decades of doing it wrong-by my own confession. I said ONCE that I've woken up-that should be the end of the questioning. "Thank God, Paul did not spend time engaging in word battles about concerns that were decades old." Those idiots, so dismissive of genuine concerns. They hurt people ACROSS THE DECADES, and dismiss it ALL as "DECADES OLD" because nobody's stepping forward whom they hurt last year. Do they really think Paul never had to look into the faces of crowds of Christians and deal with seeing people whose friends and family he had jailed or killed? No, they don't really think that- because they refuse to consider the subject at all. It's a glib DISMISSAL and a discussion CLOSER. And very convenient for those who IMMEDIATELY want to go from 'selling the Kool-Aid" to "selling the new Cristal LIte and disparaging the sellers of the Kool-Aid." This belongs in a Dr Seuss video, not a so-called Christian group. (Those with "stars upon thars" removed them and IMMEDIATELY proclaimed that was better just to make themselves different- after DECADES of saying those with the stars were better individuals.) It has to be a kid's video, since no adult would think such a gambit would work on people, right?

Thanks Taxidev. Appreciate your summary of the two responses you’ve received thus far. Thanks for whatever additions may come in the future. My thoughts? How completely presumptuous of responder #2 to tell you how Paul spent his time! Looks like their Bible has a 30 day statute of limitations against those who commit criminal acts against the Body of Christ and its members in particular! Guess they need to read Matt 18 and I&II Timothy again and again. How convenient to tell us that Paul denied his past and only looked on the things ahead. That’s THEIR excuse, not Paul’s. Dismissing their criminal behavior to mere “concerns that were decades old” worthy of only meaningless “word battles” instead of further investigation into the crimes which caused suicides, deaths, psychiatric and emotional breakdowns, dissolution of marriages, destruction of innocent souls, numerous abortions, separations of families, rampant sexual battery, abuse, and rape, is evilly self-serving, and avoidance behavior. It exemplifies their inbred cultic hubris, thinking the “mastery” of rightly-dividing the word gave them the right to do whatever they wanted whenever they wanted to whomever they wanted, as long as they “lived” the verse, “Happy is the man who condemneth not himself in that which he alloweth”. It’s all about THEM, not their victims. Truth be damned, experience dictates. Responder #1 gives the classic Pharisaic hypocritical condescending and smirking reply. “Don’t waste your time” on little ole me that you met years ago! I am so spiritually yuuuge now, that those mere human concerns are meaningless to me. “I have crucified MY flesh, how ‘bout you?” (sic!). Now that i’m such a spiritual giant, my time is far too precious to waste on unbelieving possessos like you, who just want to rehash negatives all the time! You’re like so spiritually immature! As opposed to my personal tremendous spiritual bulk! Obviously YOU haven’t renewed YOUR mind! Harumpppfff! I am so yuuuuge “spiritually” that I, The great OZ, hold no ill will against you pathetic sheep, and I am so god-like that I pray YOU can get as spiritually yuuuuge as me, and that YOU’LL finally grow up enough some day, to stop holding grudges and be spiritually yuuuuge like me! LOL! What self-serving, condescending, irrational bullshit. IMO both replies are self-serving, arrogant, prideful put-downs of the questioner. They never deny the facts behind what you imply, and instead gaslight you into thinking you are some how spiritually inept, or worse, “thinking evil” for even considering (as Eve did in the garden with Satan’s words) that there could be anything wrong with their prayshuss minus-tray! How dare YOU doubt and question my leadership! Thanks again Taxidev. Appreciate the info. Looking forward to hearing about any further responses you might receive.

I fielded a couple questions recently on this group and their communications. I only know what I've seen online but note that it's Moynihan who says - 'nothing happens without leadership, and when we have great leadership things happen greatly'.... Given the last few decades and what they've being doing, I'd have to agree - it appears obvious that In the absence of anything close to "great" leadership in the Way ... nothing great has happened for many many years, unless you count leaving being great. In which case, now that they've left, perhaps...."great leadership"....might develop? I won't develop that idea further but this is why you can't trust what so many people say. They just don't really think about what they're saying but sometimes the truth comes out anyway... Also the woman who emphasizes that the 'self governing, self propagating' aspect of the home fellowship has been "slowly taken away" is showing how blind they really are and have been. It was not slow, and for practical purposes once the 'Way Tree' was installed as a functional organizational tool that's been gone, going back to the early 70's. I would say that since Dr. Wierwille really hit the road looking to promote his newly filmed PFAL class, the organizational model of close corporate level control over everything has been in place. Certainly since the late 70's it's been impossible for any smaller ministry units like "twigs" to be truly self governing unless it's in strict "cooperation with the next higher level" of leadership. It wasn't slow by these peoples' timeline, some of them didn't even know about the Way until the 80's......edits were made to the pamphlet "First Century Church in the Twentieth" when it it went into the New Dynamic Church "The Green Book" that left out key parts of the early Acts model of growth. All classes related to the "Way Tree" and ministry outreach hammered the point of maintaining accountability to what the New Knoxville "leadership" said and did at "The Root". Allegiance to the "man of God" was promoted and the idea that you HAD to stand with him and the Way to be a "true believer" became essential long before Craig got a hold of it. (that's why Craig was able to step so easily into being a self serving Hitleresque President, the frame work already existed to keep all control within the BOT's, he just exercised it to a greater degree across all parts of the Way. ) Likewise for years and years there was a growing development of process and procedure for local fellowships to support the Way Nash by giving TO them and supporting them in all ways but little to no development of process and procedure for the Way Nash Trunk/Root level organizations BACK to support local fellowships - except in products and merchandise. The products of the ministry were books, classes, tapes and visits and assignment of Way leaders and teachers to live in areas where the ministry had work. But there was no real tangible connection to allow for the local expanding churches/twigs in a state to have autonomy amongst themselves. Everyone followed the same ministry calendar of events, parallel classes and concurrent meetings, plus attendance at all larger state and multi state meetings, reviews f the Way Magazine being done week after week, the SNS teachings being reviewed in twigs week after week - the only way or reason a local fellowship coordinator could be assured of exercising self governance was to just not tell his "next higher" level of leadership, to hide it. Which oddly was something even Dr. Wierwille advised regarding certain things....! Slowly taken away, indeed...............ah, kids, lotta things, but you gotta see it in the original to really appreciate it. It was hardly "slow" - it was actually rather quick, starting in about 1971 and moving forward from there.

In case we needed any more proof that they STILL spout the wierwille-doctrine ........ the "Thank God, Paul" is the knee-jerk response. What about Jesus Christ? Remember him...... the author and finisher of our faith. Were we called to be Paulians?

They don't WANT to engage in serious discussion. They want to preach AT him, then pass the collection plate around. Expecting the leopard to change his spots?

My take-away from the response: They made yet another plea to "sweep it under the carpet" and rolled out the time-worn cliche of Biblical icon equivalence. They really need a fresher approach if they want to engage in serious discussion.

Yeah.............totally predictable. Self-appointed sleaze.........that want to sit on an elevated perch and rule over others. They just quit pimping for the twit-cult....and wanted to start their own action, in another neighborhood. Good riddance. That's why that R&R thread is SO, DAMN INSTRUCTIVE........."meet the new boss, same as the old boss." LOL

Indeed Taxidev. Sorry they let you down. Thanks for trying. For those of us “old timers” still hanging around the GSC, this was totally predictable. Not saying, “I told ya so.” in any way. Simply stating a fact that we also have come to learn “the hard way” over the last 18 years. It always reminds me of that scene in “The Godfather”, when Clemenza is teaching Michael how to make a “good sauce”. This was right after Clemenza had overseen the hit of “Paulie”, the driver who called in sick the day the Don got shot. As he’s stirring the sauce, Sonny asks, “Where’s Paulie?” Clemenza responds, “Oh Paulie! We won’t be seein’ him no more!”. LOL! I fear you have been secretly Paulie’d, Taxidev, and you’ve been secretly “marked and avoided”!! Congratulations! They won’t be seein’ YOU no more. YOU committed treason against “the family”! YOU asked questions IN PUBLIC, about the family “business” these pimps used to run. How dare YOU question the righteous perfection of those who have chosen to RULE OVER YOU? How dare YOU harbor any misgivings about their “truthfulness” in days past, and their “faithfulness to DO da Woid”? WHO the hell are YOU?? Are you even Corpse??? LOL! How dare YOU question their past behavior, crimes, and lies! Where were YOU in 1972??? Where’s Alice?? “Oh Taxidev! We won’t be seein’ him no more!”.....The “not-really leadership” of Removal and Relocation Christian Liars, Inc., since 1942! Do as I say, and don’t question what I do! Ignore the revisionist TWIt history we “teach” you. Believe all our lies if you want to grow ”spurchly” and not be a Greasespot by midnight! Resistance is futile! We are the “spiritual” Borg. Obey, listen, or leave. So, far Taxidev, it seems you are learning the same curriculum we did back in the daze! Godspeed brother! And...........peace.

Maybe they’re shooting for the Biblical icon equivalence of hypocrisy see Matthew 23 only they just don’t realize that Actions speak louder than words...or as the Bible puts it for the acid test - demonstrate your repentance by your deeds (Matthew 3:8 and Acts 26:20).

Taxi, I don't know if people in the group, will ever "wake up." Perhaps someday they will, but I would not bet on it. F--k them, and the horse, they rode on.

DWBH, wow!! Remind me to never get on your bad side! FWIW, I think someday, I will have to answer for the life I led in this world. I cannot imagine trying to Bullsheet God; He knows my heart better than I do. I try to live my life in a way that makes God happy, with me. The Golden Rule, is the guiding principle in my life; it doesn't always work in my life, but I still try to apply it everyday. I can't imagine living my life the way VPW lived his!! No, no, no!! How will he justify his evilness, and depravity? God will have the final judgement, and I hope He is merciful with me. However, I can't imagine how he will judge a man like VPW, who used His Word, to live like the Devil. Someday, all of us will know the Wrath, or Love of God.

Hey Taxidev, thanks for trying - you’re a good man...Don’t Worry got me thinking of some good advice from “The Godfather” ...which is “leave the gun - take the cannoli”...so forget about the harmful and destructive games that they play and holdfast to that which is good...this is the I Thessalonians 5:21 film critic signing off.

Copy received! Thanks for the help, y'all.