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More like modus operandi. In present TWI the way corps on the field are the ones to really catch the brunt of the systemic cheapness. For example, branch coordinators usually work full time and then run the branch on their own time, unless it's a really large branch. In most areas their limb coordinators will question every expense that is turned in on petty cash. There is always downward pressure to do things as cheap as possible, get people to volunteer to bring cups, etc. Turning in mileage is frowned upon by most field leadership. And of course the pat answer to justify this so called frugality is for the person footing the ministry's bill to consider it abundant sharing. Drive 300 round trip on ministry business miles while gas is 3.50 a gallon? Just consider it abundant sharing and God will bless you for it. Never mind all of these people are shelling out more than %10 of their net income each pay period to the way international for the continued movement of God's Word!!! So what is the ABS actually used for? I know - that is the 52 million dollar question, now isn't it!

Cheapness. Not just frugality- it's beyond that. It's an austere stinginess. So cheap.. so cheap, the guy's idea of an anniversary present for his wife is a new bucket and mop.. but really.. from related threads, we've seen the extreme CHEAPNESS that defines "what is da way".. a "biblical research center" that would hardly survive a heavier hail storm.. wood blocks nailed together in some places, and used as wall studs. Wasn't howie the *carpenter* the one who donated so much of his "talent" on weekends to erect the brc? Cheap, lazy (how long did it take him to put up a PREFABRICATED BUILDING?? I know why you found blocks of wood nailed together and used as studs. At least I'm pretty sure of it.. This wood was absolutely, positively otherwise UNUSABLE. Junk. Would better serve as fuel to heat the office in a pot belly stove.. Some may commend this kind of frugality. That is ok.. but you would think that they would want the finest quality of material to go into the House where "da word like it hath not been known since the earth cooled" would be presented to da world. The extreme cheapness here had a "trickle down effect". Soon, it reared its ugly head in the form of borrowing funeral home chairs for classes, "bumming" "used flowers" off of the same establishments, re-using styrofoam coffee cups, "stretching" coffee.. along with. Renting (if we HAD TO) CHEAP public buildings for branch and area meetings. Still stretching coffee.. assigning people to bring cookies or snacks, made with THEIR OWN MONEY, Running branch meetings and such in a medium sized house. This was in violation of zoning ordinance. They complained about having to SPEND MONEY to secure more adequate facilities. They were relying on the church across the street to supply parking for thirty cars or so. Then made it out as an attack of da debil, when the church objected to this.. and the city then sent them a letter citing violation of said ordinance. They SCREAMED.. cheap, cheap, cheap.. Cheap. When they moved out of the area, local "believers" were expected to buy their JUNK that was left over, that they could not sell in a rummage sale. cheap.. cheaper, yet. when they moved.. they enlisted help of the locals to load up the truck. But they had to rent the CHEAPEST. They picked the smaller one, and could only get everything to fit, only after packing the truck not once, but TWICE. cheap. When the branch guy moved in, he used my service on moving in day to trace one twisted wire pair from the outside of the house to the office, not for "the work of the ministry" but for his BUSINESS PHONE. No, I didn't see (or ask for) a dime. I figured I probably saved him about $150 or so by not having the phone company do it. But the wife was concerned that I wasn't finishing the job fast enough, so as to schlep appliances and stuff in like everyone else, for free. I guess I was too accustomed with dealing with that level of arrogance. Cheap, cheap cheap bastards.. I don't know if it is really some trickle down effect.. maybe more like its a disease they caught somewhere..

Yeah........the blatant double-standard on full display. The wierwille heritage was embraced because he and his family were silver-spoon special. Yet......we, the little people, were scolded that it was "worldly" to highlight our families. Wierwille showcased his dogs, Harleys and porn movie.......hypocrisy much? [/sarc] Yet......pets and possessions were scoffed at from the preaching podium. Wierwille boasted about his individual pursuits, adventures and interests. Yet......the "little people" endured verbal abuse to keep running classes. No life. No love. No living.......in The Way. We were on the clock to sell their soap.

The Way ministry history of the day named for "Uncle Harry" VP's brother local millionaire from a furniture business. Burn the Chaff day used to be called Uncle Harry day. Why did the Way rename it? Because Uncle Harry, Harry Wierwille, at best was an enabler. An enabler of Vicster's wild scheme's, a coverer of a mutitude of sins with cash, a funder of the cult. Without Harry Wierwille's millions, the Way would not have gained the exposure worldwide that it did. Uncle Harry was known to see lots of miracles. In all actuality, if you want to get down to it, Uncle Harry was the first to institute a "pay for play" position in the Way. To this day followers of the "pay for play" philosophy in the way are treated differently than the common folk.

right Karl Marx, or those who subscribed to his ideas, tried to impose a new way of thinking onto nations, millions died for it. So I wouldn't make VPW's cult equal with religion. At least I'm convinced cults and religions arise differently. I do know Waybrain changes the meaning of things in a person's mind. Everything. And alters how they come to decisions.

To me lately it has been opposite of the Way Burn the Chaff. All those things they said to get rid of, I think are worth collecting. Childhood memories, old vinyl albums, family and time with them, good friends in the community who are not Christian, hobbies, relationships at work where you are not witnessing, neighbors, and in general the story of my life. I've got an artifact from cub scouts in my office because it makes me feel good. All those things they said to prioritize, I think are worth getting rid of. For example, Sunday Teaching service tape collections. Bye Bye. Boring the first time you heard it live, it doesn't get more exciting on tape. Way magazine articles and boxes of them. Bye Bye. You don't need them anyway, as all personality and authenticity in the teachings have been surgically removed. Besides, before long they will be further cleansed and regurgitated on a ministry website. Next, Ministry notes. Bye Bye. Somebody's rantings and personal commentary on a book of the Bible aren't worth re-reading. Ministry Bibles and all their stupid notes - also's marked, color coded to way classes with underline, whatever. Bye Bye. I'd rather read a non-annotated Bible in modern English thank you. I could give a flying rat's @$$ whether or not the italics in a Bible say somebody "changed a word". HA!. VP changed more words with his literals according to usage than any Bible scholar did anywhere with a translation. Besides, I'm not a fundamentalist anymore. I just read the Bible for positive inspiration, and sometimes for the crazy stories, and sometimes for comfort. You say it contradicts itself? Well, so does the entire human f'ing race. So what? So you know Way ministry, you were right and you were wrong about Burn the Chaff. You were right about the concept. It is nice to travel light. In modern times this concept has gained ground under a different name. Minimalism. But you as usual were wrong about the execution of it. That's because you, Way ministry, are The Chaff.

I used to think that. But. Religion got humanity through. It should be given some credit, in spite of some faults. Considering, Karl Marx didn't exactly help humanity in any real great leap forward.

Great post, chock..........good to see it again. EVERYTHING about the cult experience.......group identity, conformity, submission, culture, and a squandered future is chaff, chaff and more chaff. This chaff..........needs to be blown out the "back end" of our lives. It's worthless and should be scattered to the winds. The false teachers in the cult had twisted and manipulated what was "chaff" and what was "wheat." The Wheat............heritage, family, friends, past accomplishments, educational pursuits, special memories, faith, etc. are those which one needs to auger into storage bins of heart and soul.

It's a good idea to reread PoP every few years when in recovery from twi exposure. It's amazing how much the content changes every few years. :) The last time I read it, it was a lot more shocking than the time before, which was already a shock.

The Corps Chalet was built on the concept of visiting corps graduates, while at hdqts, to spend quality time with Dr. and Mrs. Wierwille in later years. The structure of the chalet had a wrap-around balcony to accommodate 40-60 people in a casual, comfortable setting and the 4 'corps-tels' were for overnight guests. Each of the 4 corps-tels had a different, interior wood...ie mahogany, red oak, etc. A loft in the chalet was available for extra sleep-over corps far less privacy than the corps-tels. The kitchen was designed to serve groups of people with greater ease and function. On corps nights, this project and its purpose was disclosed to the corps..... and they anticipated, and worked, towards its completion. For about three months, Dr. and Mrs. Wierwille lived in the Corps Chalet. The master bedroom was on the second floor with other rooms and amenities. The first floor had another bedroom for live-in assistance. At the time, a 7th corps couple were assigned as 'valets' to help the wierwilles. And, of course.....large stone fireplaces and a very nice office tucked on the northside with bay-window view of the way woods. Additions were made years later.....so others would have to speak of those. I believe the last time I was in the corps chalet was 1984. After three months (1981)......wierwille was ready to move back to his home. Some reasons were given on a corps night, but suffice it to say......the 'vision of the corps chalet' was quickly swept aside and martindale was president-elect at the time. In one swift motion, wierwille designated that the martindales would move into the corps chalet as he was the Corps Director, and all. Just like that....the 'corps chalet was gone' and became the private home of the martindales. With each passing year, few corps were ever invited to the corps chalet. It simply became off-limits and twi's security patrols kept people from trespassing. Yes.....trespassing. The corps chalet was added to the list of broken promises, broken dreams. <_<

Don't excuse vpw and company with the Great Depression. They spent lots of money when they wanted to. They just wanted EVERYONE ELSE to live at a low standard. The "Corps Chalet" was promised to the people who worked on it-they and their peers would get to use it. But it turned out nice and was given to lcm to use, no apologies given. vpw told people that CREMATION was a good way to be buried, then had arrangements to have himself buried in a fancier style. lcm learned to make sure he ate enough food in college if not sooner. (College students learn that, and any football coach will make sure his team isn't starving if he has to get on them to eat-as if that's ever an issue.) After a few years with vpw, lcm had learned to be so cheap that he sent of twi worker bees without any CHANCE at breakfast. (You're not getting anything out of ME that way-I need food or that's all I'm going to think about UNTIL I get food.) vpw had to moderate his words and try to explain the difference between "stingy" and "cheap"-as vpw saw it, one is good, the other is not. vpw lived in as fancy a style as he could siphon off of twi at any time. He told OTHER PEOPLE to do things, and when they weren't looking, he had a different standard for HIMSELF.

One year, I was home for Christmas break. I ran into a couple local guys who had just gone into WC3 or WC4 who were also on break. (I lose track of the numbers thing.) They were all excited about how they learned you could have more abundance if you used less toothpaste. I thought, WTF??? This is the "how to" of the abundant life?? I could have gotten better advice on how to be a cheapskate from my Grandparents, who discovered all sorts of tricks during The Great Depression. Red flags waving but I chose to ignore them.

It was a diseased Chestnut--couldve been a beauty but it had a catastrophically bad case of root rot--its nearly extinct now

:blink: Mission Impossible/Improable: Good morning Way Corp member, your mission which you must accept is give the Devil his due. Should you or your team get captured, get sick, leave, or die, this ministry will deny your existence. I would say good luck but we don't believe in luck, so get going. This tape will end with Martindale's screaming/shouting, yelling/bullying with physical threats of death to you. :unsure:

"Mission Creep" Isn't that what it said on wierwille's name tag?

very thoughtful post, Skyrider - thanks! flip flopping "mission creep" might work another way too - - - creep mission = the goal of a repulsive cult leader

How is bitter being defined? Who is defining it? Is bitterness being defined by someone still in denial? No, being bitter doesn't mean ones conclusions are wrong or their logic is flawed. Of course not, it usually means someone is processing an injustice, working it out, dealing with their emotions, and BEING HUMAN!! People who were at one time conditioned to deaden and deny their emotions...may need to be vocal and learn to process. What better way than with those who have experienced the same thing under the same bizarre set of restrictions and legalism? It may even be healthy and truly helpful! But, of course, if one is still entrenched in that same emotionally stifling world view and mind set....then they are probably not really qualified to even define an emotion. I remember what I thought passed as bitterness, or love, mercy, sympathy, empathy, kindness, care, concern, hope, joy, and the rest in TWI. It was fairly warped and the TWI mindset was not a good way to get in touch or deal with genuine emotion.

Nothing---and I mean nothing ----could ever come close to the boredom elicited by "Basic Keys To Research". Think about how ironic that is in light of The Way promoting itself, in part, as a "research" ministry.

Oh, you mean that was a parody?

To add: Paul's description of himself in I Cor. 4 as father is fairly clear. (I think) Though the people he was writing to had many teachers or instructors, they have one person who had "fathered" them in Christ or had "begotten them through the gospel". He also asks them to be "imitators" of him and that Timothy would soon be there to "remind" them of "his ways". There's a two fold relationship and responsibility being described. "Paul" defends his lifestyle, habits and actions amongst those he's talking to here - in fact, he does that several times throughout these epistles. He doesn't say "follow me", I "fathered" you - regardless of what I do and/or teach - he asks this of them because he wishes to fulfull the responsibility of his relationship, one that he's held up on his end by the way he lived and conducted himself. He's trustworthy and has proven it so he asks for trust. He's taught them at great personal expense and effort and asks that they give him respect for that effort. Y'know - I don't dance on VPW's grave and there was great value for me in the Way and learning as I did. But - I don't care whose feelings it hurts - VPW simply didn't fill the role of "father" when he was playing around, screwing his marriage up,taking advantage of younger women, and failing his responsibilities to his children by putting their entire lives at risk, and very importantly leaving all of it for others to deal with after his death. I'm sure they don't like hearing about it Exkarate' - I wouldn't either. But who's fault is it? If nothing else he could have settled his life's business before he died, he certainly knew it was coming. He didn't - he let it go. So the way this has rolled out is ultimately because of both what he did and how he left it for others to deal with. That's being a "bad" father in the Word" as far as I'm concerned. (and my wife and family feel the same way)

That's pretty good Thomas. All it's missing is a little Drambuie. Wait, a lot of Drambuie.

our father in the word, hollow and unholy is your name, your tyranny come, your will be done on earth as it is in hell.give us this day your daily sex, and never forgive us of our own sins but forgive yours done to us. lead us in temptations and deceive us into evil. for yours is the kingdom, and power/authority, and self glory now and forever. Amen.

Our fader in da word. Drambuie be thy name.. thy kingdom(?) come.. hollow be thy name..

sadly some of his descendants choose to roll in his iniquity..

How anyone can build an offshoot on this man's legacy is beyond me. I abhor Vic. He was a POS rapist, plagiarizing, scum bag. And that is being kind. May all of his sins rest squarely on his own shoulders.

The first time I heard it was in the Renewed Mind Class, and it bothered me, I thought it was weird. When I graduated high school and went into the College Division, I felt bad because I didn't like Wierwille; he bugged me. I thought he was obnocious. I never had been around him before. But, after a year of indoctrination I was buying it all hook, line, and sinker. I was weeping calling him my "father in the Word". Mind you, I never had a personal conversation with the man my whole 15 years in TWI...scared of him. Yet, for some reason I had all these "gooshy" feelings about Wierwille. I believed he was The Man of God. It's amazing what a difference a year of "maturity" can make. I went from reading the man perfectly as a con, to worshipping him and calling him my father. Personally, I think I was starving for a father figure and fatherly affirmation and I would do anything to get even an illusion of it. Sad sad sad.

I guess this would make brother Harry "our uncle in the upholstery business"......except that he wasn't our uncle and his best "cover up" skills didn't involve sofas and chairs.

one does not have to enjoy

Even in my glazed-days.......I REFUSED to swallow this. Never endorsed it. Never taught it. Never promoted it.