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Hi Grace VC - I always look forward to when you're on a posting spree - I appreciate your input. Tonto and I are re-watching The Office - we're up to season 4; the relationship between Michael and Jan is so funny and interesting too! It reminds me of us - we both have issues - but unlike Michael I try to not be so oblivious to my weirdness; often as another way of saying I love you to each other one of us will say " thanks for putting up with me." Acceptance

Wow!! Rocky, I have never read any place where people did that to him. For those who did, good for them! But you do have a good point; just because I haven't read about it in the GSC, doesn't mean that it didn't happen.

Why would you assume nobody did that?

Hey Mike! Ten years?? Is that all?? Good to see you. For all of you who have never "discussed" dictor paul wierwille and his "god breathed" books with Mike, you are in for a real treat, if Mike sticks around. Please do Mike! I'm making popcorn. Glad all is well with and for you, Mike. Thanks for stopping by. See ya around the threads!........peace.

Any narcissist who finds other people getting "his" spotlight- especially one who finds their skill in an area exceeds his. Like, say, he's an amateur musician who can't sing and they're professionals.

Hi all! imho, anyone who accepts anything any of these brain-dead Nazis says, "teaches", writes, or thinks about, or is not delusional, paranoid nacrsissistic psychobabble, should now, once and for all have their doubts explained or their "consciences" seared. What a total crock of shit. LMAO at these self-important, self-inflated, and self-deluded morons.

Soooo........If the books were so great, why weren't people encouraged to or even allowed to purchase them without the formality of a prescribed dosage plan? (I love the smell of rhetoric in the morning.)

Like changing captains on the Titanic. Why is everyone debating this as if it's anything other than a total sham from beginning to end. The "snow on the gas pumps" story should have been my first and only indicator that TWI was a total fraud from the beginning. Obviously I didn't so I shouldn't be surprised the good folks here are still chewing the rancid cud of TWI. None of this matters so long as the group remains.

Hey Rosalie...........looks like you've pulled a fast one over the Klutz Cabinet, because they all want to stay on payroll. And, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if, in three years, Donna Lombardi Martindale is "installed" on the Cult Board.....and you "step aside." LOL It hardly matters who sits where......that game of "musical chairs" is a ruse. And Rosalie..........my wife just received facebook correspondence from one of your twi-clergy stating that your leadership was/is pathetic. When people on the field are empowered to voice their stated beliefs........they mock hq-leadership and its worthless drivel.

Hmmm. Just indulge me here in a wee bit of fantasy: Wouldn't it be interesting (and oh so sweet!) if LCM could ever be persuaded to attend a "party" somewhere, and all the invitees are people he used, abused, sexually assaulted, maligned, betrayed, slandered and smeared to others, M&A'd, etc.! They could each step up and tell their story. The problem is he hasn't a shred of humility to make the listening worthwhile. I do hope there is a day of reckoning coming for Twinkletoes in Tights..

No need to apologize. Thanks for letting us know. Take care of yourself and your family.

Teachings, Meetings: Incoming When I looked at the concept of teachings, meetings etc......I tended to put them in three categories: The recipient: I need, or chose, to be at this teaching/meeting.....i.e. "butt in a seat" The overseer/teacher: Following chain-of-command training or specific guidelines of twi-doctrine, sunday teachings and/or "theme related" Beyond-the-nine-dots: Thinking and moving beyond twi's box.......teachings, weddings, funerals, lake-limb mtgs, etc. The higher one climbed or was positioned on that "overseer plateau"......the less his/her butt was in a chair. He got to move around or stand up front.....i.e. more leeway and variety. With this responsibility came a down-side, of course....it was very challenging to keep up with the onslaught of directives, requests, classes, seminars, etc. that were incoming. While in Canada, I took flights to Vancouver and Calgary three or four times a year....maybe a couple more if I was performing a wedding or funeral. Somewhere along the line, I started viewing this responsibility of overseeing specific teachings/meetings/activities as incoming flights......like an air-traffic controller viewing radar/scanner/flight patterns and 6-7 different planes incoming, at different altitudes, sequential arrival times. I, too, at times.....had six or seven different types of meetings, teachings, seminars, or weddings incoming....at different stages, different settings and variables. There were times when those mandated classes was sheer drudgery. Other stuff.....outside "the nine dots" was exhilarating......like limb events at the lake, weddings, advances and such. In Canada, we had the freedom to fly....unrestricted by heavy doses of oversight [.....probably, because of three reasons: 1) we didn't ask for permission to do this stuff, 2) It was a big country that required plenty of travel, and 3) In 1985-87 era....wierwille died, geer "poop" paper and ensuing exodus....kept trustees super busy, no micromanagement]. This "other stuff" (#3) was, often, what kept my motor running. Some of it was "rogue"....now that I look back on it. At the time, I just saw it as walking in love. And, believe me.....by 1998, I understood the essence of "butt in a seat." I'd done it for years, even decades......every Tuesday, I sat and listened to that sunday teaching tape, took notes and filed them away. Then, on Wednesday morning.....listened to martindale for three hours. Add those monthly, rotating limb meetings with region guy.....add another 15 hours with "butt in a seat"......and the drive home (butt in a seat). As best I could, I had compassion for people sitting during teachings, classes or events.....because one of the hardest things about the corps training, corps week, roa, and beyond was MY butt in a seat.

January 1998: Meetings Roared Back To Life: As always, the daily and weekly schedule of meetings came roaring back to life. Twi was in the business of staying "spiritually relevant" in peoples' lives. You can't just trust people to go out there, live life, and walk for God. You have to coerce them....nudge them forward every day. And, when nudging doesn't work.....a shove, here and there, will do. Meetings involve all the complexities......that thrust the twi-bureaucracy into home fellowships, into living rooms. Meetings nudge the populace; corps meetings shoved the corps, now salaried employees. The corps meetings, every Wednesday morning, gave martindale access to "shove us around." Several times I fumed after those meetings, thinking....."Who in the hell is in charge of this house and family, him or me?" I was dissenting.....the gap was widening. Back in '95, when this "full-time corps employee" was implemented, there were six of us at the table. A year later, in OKC we'd been scaled back to four corps in attendance......and now, there was just the two of us.....my wife and me. The dress code was still in effect....coat and tie, for these "sit at a table conference calls" and now, my dissent on this stupid dress code began. I was grappling with the spiritual abuse that came, weekly, gushing forth from martindale via these corps meetings. I started loosening my tie, more and more each week.....heck, it was pretty damn near an open collar actually. It felt good......

Part IV 1998: The Money Iceberg There it was..........looming, out there in icy waters.... Little did many realize the imminent danger and peril that lurked in dark waters.......the foreboding that was coming. ~~~~~~~~~ The first few days of the new year were always difficult for us....particularly, at this stage of child-rearing. These were the fun years, ages 12 and 10, when little boys (...no offense to those with little girls).....were impressionable, full of energy, somewhat mischievous....and, if we didn't grab those moments of fun, laughter, and family traditions, it would be too late. They would soon be out the door.....and gone. The "money iceberg" was looming, still out there....but noticeably, now within our path...... Our boys would be heading back to school and those last vestiges of the holiday season would be disappearing from view. And yet, I didn't want to let them go.....not yet, anyways. Why have kids if you don't relish the moments together? Those treasured-gifts of life that so quickly pass out of sight.....grow up.....and are gone. Children are the building blocks of future generations......hopes, strength, prosperity, security. The scriptures overflow with these truths. And yet, it seemed that I was in the throes of two emerging worlds......the one I believed in my heart, and the other was "the ministry's world".....a world that was increasingly anti-family (a world that I'd been trying to justify since my first WOW year and its mandate to "stay put".......no going home for the holidays). Three years in a row, I'd missed spending Thanksgiving with our boys.....not to mention, being with my parents and siblings. God, I loved Thanksgiving ....it was my favorite holiday. And, now.....the Christmas season was undermined by that damn "bribery letter" AND "gift policy crap" that stole the joy of giving. My wife loved buying little gifts for those in her circle of love......but then, it heaped guilt and confusion on the believers surrounding us. They were conflicted, the advanced class grads most notably.....because they didn't want to be in the crosshairs of "bribing leaders." What a twisted, contorted world I was clinging to. Wierwille had taught us long ago that The Way ministry was the true household of God...... your parents, siblings and relatives were your "earthly family." Oh God, how I hated that term.

Thanks Skyrider!! So much excellent firsthand information and insight. Thanks again for all your time and effort in the series of posts you have given us. Very interesting to me, since I was gone by 1986. I can relate to all your details and yet, I am astounded at how rotten da forehead and all the boyz in the hoods became. Thanks again!

The years skyrider is writing about have been eyeopening for me. We got in in '80 and left in '87. Had no idea of the depth of depravity twi had sunk to. Knew it was bad, (which is why I got out) but didn't know how far reaching the manipulation and control had become. Thank you for taking your time to help me personally.

Happy New Year Everyone: This will be my last post today, so I wanted to wish you all a Happy New 2017 Year. I plan to watch lots of football, eat snacks and later.....enjoy a couple of Jack and Cokes (maybe, three....just to defy any lingering two-drink limit data that needs deleted from waybrain). Most likely, unless someone comes along with a five million dollar publishing bonus, up front.......this series of posts will be "the book I never wrote, but should have." It does seem fitting though (as of this posting)......today marks the 100th year of victor paul wierwille's birth. A man who claimed to be on a quest to help people........left a wake of devastation. ~~~~~~~~~~ Endings -- New Beginnings: The 1997 Year was ending and......this 1998 Year would be the year that me and my family exited twi never to return. This certainly would be "new beginnings" for the rest of our lives. Should old acquaintance be forgot and never brought to mind...i.e. Auld Lang Syne......apples/oranges I suppose according to context of song vs acquaintances in a cult. Whatever. To me, there's a vast difference between the hierarchy of this cult and the people caught in its web. I have many wonderful memories of people.....unique, loving, individuals.....who were in, or now out, of twi. Personally, I resent the labels and grouping of people....i.e. corps, corps spouse, corps alumni, advanced class grads, etc......but to effectively communicate and expose this cult, I don't see another effective method to convey its tentacles. Should I reverse the groupings? Why all the labeling of corps this, corps that.....as if they are the most important? They aren't (more important).....just more intricately connected to the levels of power and abuse. Adios, 1997.......... ~~~~~~~~~~ When I'm in a reflective mood, as I will be today.........I see individuals, special and unique. Those whom my wife and I love and have loved thru the years. Those still at hq.....in canada.....in oklahoma.....and those, here in indiana. I hold no bitterness to any of them. I wish them well. Some who've exited are dear friends from decades past and now we spend time enjoying them, their kids and grandbabies........but there are still others who are ensnared. If that's their choice to stay, then happy living. But if some are institutionalized by coercion and deception.......there is a way out. Thanks, in large part to GSC, more are re-connecting with loved ones of their past.....and stirred onward to embrace new beginnings, new relationships. All the best.....to all of you. Happy New Year. See you in 2017. Football, snacks and drinks......woohoo.

I just want to say to you, Skyrider, that I am enjoying your posts immensely. Your recall is astounding and writing skills superb. Thanks for sharing all this. When I see your "name" on a post, I know it's going to be good. God's blessings to you.

The Question Is Always.......Why? Why......did you stay so long? Why......didn't you leave when you saw red flags? Why......didn't you just leave the corps program and walk? Why......didn't you confront wierwille/martindale on this? One of the reasons for telling my story is........because I think it's a compelling story. In the process of living life, I unearthed me.....the things deep down, the things I value, what I stand for, and what I will not stand for, why I refuse to quit when things get rough, the inner core of what I want my kids to know about me......yeah, who I really am. Do other people search deep into their hearts in earnest? I don't know. Perhaps, it was all that open space and thought time while driving tractors on the farm. I could probably trace its roots all the way back to my childhood.....when I pondered at the stars in the night sky. But really......its when I went off to college that I took those first steps of my journey. Should I regret my involvement in twi? To a small degree, yes.......but mainly, no. Why "the small degree, yes?"........because I regret the estrangement that was built between me and my parents via lack of communication, sudden changes, foolish spontaneity, and weird behavior (zeal in an obscure cult). How could they possibly understand my dropping out of college, going wow ambassador two years, back to back? They were perplexed and frightened.....and I seemed to be "behind a wall" to them. Years later, when I was months away from corps graduation.......they really thought they'd lose me forever (ex-communicated like scientology people), so my parents paid something in the neighborhood of $16,000 to get me deprogrammed from this cult. They were ready and willing to do it for my fiancé as well. They were right from the get-go...about twi. A parents' love looks different when you're a young adult.....as opposed to when, decades later, you look back. Suffice it to say, after this 10-day episode and I went back to twi.....my parents were deeply broken. And, even though I regained a small measure of that relationship back ten years before my father's death......the wounds were scarred in sorrow. This deprogramming episode was/is on both sides of my measuring "regret." As for "mainly, no?"........sure, I despise the corps indoctrination and exploitation et al, but I can't, deep within my heart, regret going into the corps, and on staff at hq......because, only on this path would I have continued to grow in love with this beautiful woman whom I, later, married. We were separated from one another during my final in-residence year and writing letters back and forth, love-planning for our lives together. But an unforeseen detour awaited us......don't they always? During my corps block at Camp Gunnison, my parents came to visit unannounced on a Friday afternoon in late April. Tom J., the corps coordinator, told me I couldn't leave grounds, but rather could go out to breakfast with them in town the next morning. So, my parents left and got a motel room in Gunnison. In the morning, my parents picked me up at camp gunnison, at the gate, and we went to breakfast. Deceptively, they'd schemed a plan involving stopping back at their motel room before buying me some new clothes. Little did I realize the four men, thugs, who rushed thru the motel door and body-slammed me on the bed.....then, bound my hands, duct-tapped my legs together and gagged me before carrying me to a cargo van headed to Kansas. Gone without a trace. My fiancé worried and wondered. Twi sent out "enforcers" to my hometown to find me and bring me back...with no success. Ten days of deprogramming tactics.....[weeks later, I typed 36-pages detailing the account]. After the deprogramming, and slipping out the side door of that half-way house......I was flown to the Dayton airport, greeted by my fiancé and twi's security unit en route back to hq. After corps graduation, we were married in the brc and worked on staff. We have two wonderful sons. Thankfully, we exited before the gaunlet of classes and indoctrination. that awaited them. I could brag about them both.....their achievements and success. Isn't this the kind of drama, struggle, obstacles, pain, love and redemption that movie-goers go to see? To go "back in time" and change my twi-involvement, would change everything in my life. Why did I stay so long? Because.......I was waiting for the confluence of multiple variables to flow together. I was waiting for the right moment where all of us, together, could jump and roll.....and walk away uninjured. The right spot, the right conditions.....helping others, too, if we could.....before jumping. I remember someone once said....."It's not what we do in life that we regret...it's what we don't do." I was doing what I thought was right.

The Social Element: The fabric of twi was/is interwoven by many threads.....social, psychological, ethical, financial, spiritual and more. Certainly, I am no expert on the social/psychological forces that motivate individuals to do what they do.....but, I think it's safe to say that "the social element" was a major portion of twi's "tapestry." Yeah, I know......people claimed that it was "the doctrine, the scriptures, the word" that drew them in, kept their zeal and why they didn't/don't leave.....but is that for real? From my experiences, I believe that the SOCIAL was "the red thread" that was interwoven, and pronounced, the most throughout the organization. The longer one stayed.......the more inter-connected the threads of relationships. And memories. People have a tendency to overlook lots of stuff.......as long as there is social value to that involvement. Whether its a club, association, church, fitness gym.......or GASP, twi. Whether doctrine or behavior.....who wants to mount a confrontation? Will it help? Will it backfire? Can you prove it? What if you're wrong in what you thought you saw? Will you be publically slandered like many other corps? The psychology elements are in direct correlation with the social elements in relationships and society, no? In other words........people stayed because they were interconnected to others. Whether it was friends, family members, husband/wife, children, co-workers, employer/employee, boyfriend/girlfriend, dating someone ("date&switch")......or 30 other types of relationships. Some stayed even though they wanted to exit BECAUSE they didn't want to "disconnect" from a loved one [scientology documentary just exposed this trauma in great detail]. Some stay because of fear.....fear of change, divorce, loss of job, start over, etc. etc. or the unknown. The GSC is a goldmine for reasons why people stayed or exited. Hundreds of threads tell the story. It wasn't just teachings of THE BIBLE.......or PFAL. ppffffftt .

Advanced Class Grads: Before moving on, I would like to give a shoutout to advanced class grads. I know that this timeline is focused on my limb coordinator experience and the full-time corps aspects......but really, I could give dozens and dozens of accounts of the many wonderful advanced class grads near and far. When we ran classes, none of it would have been possible, in depth and heart, without the support and giving of your talents and time. Branch meetings, special seminars, Pentecost weekends, limb events, weddings, etc..........advanced class grads provided the backbone of support. Thank you for all of it. You, too, gave time away from your families and kids to help serve. You, too, got less sleep or carried burdens that you probably got very little thanks in return. Some of my fondest memories were with you. Heck, there was a time when things were less crazy that we went snow skiing together (Whistler, British Columbia, Canada) or those times of basketball, waterskiing, golf outings, movies, barbeques, etc. Many of you advanced class grads sponsored us thru the corps program.....even when we didn't write letters of thanks all that often. Some of you had businesses and offered employment to us wandering corps. I am indebted to so many advanced class grads who helped carry me when I was weary of heart. Thanks....you helped me in so many ways and changed my life and my family. .

You make good points, even beside spelling out the historical events. For those of us who invested years of our adult lives in twi, it's tempting to be angry about lost time. The fact of the matter is that we are the sum total of our experiences. We can make the most, even of the regrettable experiences. Thanks for making those points.

I'd like to join in on these thank-yous as well. Especially to Pawtucket for making this important and necessary site available. The good it does for many is clear and provable!

wow ... what sweet humility here (don't want to embarrass you by that ... just writing what I saw/felt as I read this!) There's something so damn attractive and endearing to me about a humble man! Your wife and you sound like beautiful folks. : ) (I liked the "I started out small -- on vacation, mother's day, etc".!) Funny. Thanks for such refreshing honesty -- great to read! Funny -- I also have shed the twit indoctrination re: homosexuality ... actually, I'm somewhat ashamed I held it for quite a few years. It was so sickeningly judgmental. And when you consider that Twinkle Toes w/ the enormous forehead was a massive adulterer, it really infuriates beyond anything that he led the homo purges and messed up so many people's lives in the process!

Mitigating the damage: Thanks to all the GSC posters for telling your experiences and thoughts of twi. Thanks to the book authors of The Cult that Snapped, Losing the Way, and Undertow. Thanks to all you brave souls who are coming to GSC....and, perhaps, will someday post too. Thanks to all you parents who have warned your kids about twi. A special thanks to Pawtucket for keeping the doors open. Damage Control: Woe to those who conceal evil. Woe to the twi-leadership who swoop into states and areas to spread lies and mount a character-assassinate of the reputation of good, solid leaders who chose to exit. Woe to the hq-staffers who hide behind their desks for a pittance paycheck. Woe to the splinter groups who feed from the wierwille-mog trough. .

Not necessarily, but you would do well to take your blinders off and consider that you're not always right.