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Okay. I read through this long-winded snoozer. I swear I have never seen a document that says less in more words. What is the problem? Rosalie took over the cult in the same fashion it was modeled by the former 2 presidents. As opposed to how she promised she would with distributing the balance of power. Totality of control. Totality of decision making power. This reminds me of the challenges raising kids. They don't listen to what you say. But they model what you do 100% perfectly. These leaders don't know to do anything different than start another cult. They never have had anything different modeled. All they have really experienced through modeling is how to run a cult, not how the true body of Christ interacts. As a result of that, I would like to comment on what I would consider the best of the splinters. CFFM. Started out to preserve "the truth" of the ministry but correct the practical error. I'm sure they still do that to a certain extent. But go read one of their publications now. You've got Tonya S in charge now because her dad who founded the splinter promised it to her as an inheritance basically. Now the language of the publications is changing slightly to emphasize the structure of the group, coded language is being invented - state contacts - regional contacts, etc. Do you think in another decade or two there is any way they will avoid the same "the purpose of the twig is to carry the heart of the BOD to each leaflet on the tree" type of logic??? In that document I love how Way leaders always over-inflate their own importance by talking about how we are going to lose the "Great Mystery" TM in practical application. First off, it's not rocket science that Christians should work together. In fact, most churches in your own city have done a better job of this than the Way for decades. They collaborate to feed the homeless, help the downtrodden, and pair up with other ministries doing things like working to end sex slavery with groups like Exodus Road. Actually, most churches in your own city - to be better than the Way, all they would need to do is not have their community neighbors hate them. The whole fact that this is such a revelation to people wanting to leave the Way is a testament to the destructive isolationist mindsets taught with the whole "household versus body" teachings. They are emerging with a slanted perspective on this here. I mean, HELLO, you already lost the mystery a long time ago functionally. And in reality, if what you mean by the mystery is Christians collaborating and working together for a common cause, it was never there in the Way ministry to start with. The Way is a separatist cult, not looking to collaborate with the rest of the body of Christ, but to isolate believers off from the body of Christ. And its leaders know nothing different. When there is dissent, what do they do? Redefine what the word "household" means, and circle the troops. Now, "household" to the Way members means all of those people not associated with "Revival and Restoration". In all actuality, if you want to get real about what "the household" is, it is whatever group of people that is currently in the BOD good favor. So what are these people doing to fix it? Ensuring that they get marked and avoided, and leaving while trying to draw the most amount of people away with them. Are they going to be better than the cult? Sure they are. They have all the same great intentions of other splinters. I'm sure everything will be fine. After all, they have one thing down already. Being able to produce a bunch of hot air with little substance.

Welcome to Grease Spot, Junior CS Great line But a tad hypocritical for a “church” ! I was in Family Corps 11 but left TWI during our Interim year (or whatever the hell it was called after 2 years of in-residence training); but I’m still flabbergasted whenever I hear of the sordid details from others who have left. Geez Louise, TWI had one hell of a Pharisee Training Program…I’m so glad you’re out – hang in there – we’re all survivors here. The corps principle acquire an in-depth spiritual perception and awareness when “decrypted” pragmatically actually means to achieve the same calloused self-righteous perspective as vp, oblivious to its effect on yourself and others. Maybe there’s something to the phrase “love is blind”. I was so enamored with vp that I never saw through his man-of-gawd façade. I’ve mentioned several times on Grease Spot, the pajama party vp had for the Family Corps one night, showing his favorite porn video – and the most frightening thing that still comes to my mind anytime I recall that night is to realize how powerful their indoctrination process was – for at the time, no alarms of impropriety sounded in my head nor did I hear of anyone else voicing concerns afterwards. I’d like to elaborate on your statement “The Rock was not about God or The Bible for us” – that goes for the whole enchilada! Anything that came from vp was not really about God or the Bible – it was more about how great vp was…First order of business for anyone in TWI who is sick and tired of the repression, confusion, hatemongering, hypocrisy, etc. – they need to address the elephant in the tomb – the sick and depraved legacy of vp.

Oh heavens no, they do NOT intend to start a new splinter cult! HAHAHAHAhahahahaha! Methinks they doth protest too much (with their denials when asked about intent to start a new group).

R n R...Ream' em 'n Rape' em? I mean, come on...the people on that list are suddenly awakened to all the evil of the past 40+ years? Give me a break. Try Repent 'n Restitution, for starters, sweet cheeks.

I seriously doubt God is talking to anyone in TWI. But then again, I could be wrong.

In case you can't find it on FB...

O.k. well Here's a little something from me as a token of my appreciation of what yáll do...sorry it's in Australian dollars :)

JCS, I totally sympathize with you needing to vent. That is total creepster material with VPW there. I never even heard that before or that phrase. I had to look it up in the Urban Dictionary - sorry to be naive. Apparently this seems to be part of an overall rapist mindset that VPW had in general. Pathological. One more nail in the coffin that apparently is being constructed by Jesus on another thread. You Jr. Corpse have my sympathies in general. Communal oversight always looked to me to be somewhat abusive.

Haha. Now this is where the Way has gone really downhill. I mean first you have a guy with a cereal box send-in PhD in homiletics, followed by a jock-type illogical homophobe screamer, followed by the southern drawl you to sleep obsessive retired English teacher whose skills lend more towards the Dewey Decimal system and library management rather than actually being seen or heard in public. Push from behind paper. A definite decrease going on here. A denouement. Will you squeak out loud, little new President mouse? Or only from behind closed doors? Will you be like those Proverbs 6:13 speaks about, a worthless person who winks with his eyes, signals with his feet, who points with his fingers; who with perversity in his heart continually devises evil, who spreads strife? Will you live your life a good little marionette puppet whose limbs go where the puppetmaster's strings pull them? So far you are ferocious one on one marking and avoiding people. A lion in the dark. Yet a mouse in the light.

Commenting on the REV. The major flaw I see in it is its roots. What roots you say? The roots of scholarly modeling what VPW did in his works. What scholarly model you say is this? Why, plagiarism, lack of peer review, lack of source citation, lack of collaboration with educational entities of the day and time, and other such egotistical and isolationist flaws that in our modern world consist of red flags to a genuine scholarly work. In it's least common denominator it is a commentary. Is it wrong to like a commentary? No, different strokes for different folks. Controversial stories and commentaries on the Bible and Christ have been around for a while. I'm thinking right now of a work, "The Last Temptation of Christ" - a historical novel by Nikos Kazantzakis. The novel, published in 1960, was later the inspiration for an equally controversial movie adaptation in 1988 released by Martin Scorsese. I know that has nothing to do with the topic - consider it added color commentary :)

Haha. Preach it brother. Absolutely. the FACTS would astound all. Many of them are buried within threads on this forum. And trail back decades. I mean wasn't Boob the original yes-man replacement when VP wanted to get rid of was it Heefner? Or Doop? All the way back to early 70's groovy Christians. Serial adultery. All your points are right on. What was the trigger here? Was it baby Brian falling out of favor and Ch@ndler Greene falling in favor? And forced retirement for all except the queen bee of the colony? I always look for a personal selfish reason many of these people I've seen as sycophants for decades are now turning into martyrs with a soul. I 100% agree with you. The answer is not current BOD step down to "preserve the mystery". The answer is burn it all to the ground, dismantle the organization, get rid of the $$$ and assets that have caused leaders for years to protect their filthy lucre with Machiavellian predictability. Give it all away to charity. If you want a new ministry, ministries, church, churches, or genuine God movement, get rid of the name "the Way". At this point all that name has done is anti-Christ - to replace Christ - the real way, with a false way consisting of moral midgets with lofty titles standing in the place where Christ should be.

And Rico thought that Rosalie would listen to audible revelation? Where has he been living the last 20 years? And why would God need to give audible revelation for information that was easily obtainable through observation and reasoning? The only thing that makes any kind of remote sense with that story is that Rico was so enveloped, encrusted, and ensnared by the Way and his position in the Way that God had to yell at him to wake him up audibly. If that happened to me, I would be ashamed, not using it to blame God for my actions that I should have taken and knew to take 2 decades ago. Rico gets no quarter from me. Now make no mistake I am glad that he, Robin and family have escaped the clutches of the cult. But it's coming up on more than a decade as Corps Director under this regime. All with a funded high salary, a house in NK paid cash for, and all the perks of the position. Most of the secrets the BODummies knew, you also knew. God shouldn't have to yell at you. Especially after having seen so many lives decimated while not uttering a peep. Rico was always the zealot's zealot. Run to serve. When they say jump he says how high. When Rosalie said work the Word on debt, he complies, producing one of the most convoluted cr@p teachings on the topic ever known to mankind. I mean half the d@mn debt policy is constructed off that workmanship of the Word produced by Rico. Great piece of kiss-@$$ work there. I especially liked the bit about how some universal truths transcend administrations, like debt and tithing. So appropriate for keeping the thumb on the head of all the little people. So my advice to Rico is once they start that next little VPW worship splinter group, the first thing he should do is publish an update to that piece of cr@pola. And don't try to sell me any old wineskins, I'm not in the market.

Well, since former is an adjective, it would have to modify a noun, and the only one in the sequence is grad, so it's OK, I guess. (It would have had to have been formerly to modify marked and avoided.) Perhaps the addition of commas would have helped: "former, marked and avoided, 2nd Corps grad." Anyway, back to our regularly scheduled thread... George

Rehash all you need. I do often, ive posted here over the years for my own recovery as well as a warning for others who may consider the way international a legitimate ministry.

"God told me to tell you."

It's just a matter of time. When vpw decided to start his own group, he stayed on church payroll for several years, while he set everything up. Once he had his (plagiarized) class and (plagiarized) book, his congregation (who were part of the church first), and a location (the farm having been partly renovated), THAT was when he officially resigned from his church. The people here, most of the top ones were actually in when the first exposures came in the 80s. To have stayed through that-and then to have stayed through all the purges and exits in the DECADES since, only to leave NOW- well, the reason's rather obvious. They decided they were done taking orders and passing along donations. They want to be the last stop for donations and give the orders. So, they spent the last several months to a year setting things up. All of this is all technicalities and "going through the motions." They're already committed to their new organization, RaR.

Thanks T Bone. I would say that, speaking for myself, Twig and TWI in general was about The Bible. I started in TWI when I was 4 so it was all I new and for the most part I took it very seriously. But a raging hormonal teen is still a raging hormonal teen. At Corps Week/The Rock I rarely went to the big top teachings. I didn’t work. I didn’t do anything but eat, sleep, drink, smoke and fool around with girls. And I certainly wasn’t alone in that. My kids do not know a life with the level of freedom I had in Ohio. It’s completely inappropriate.

I was in the Springs from 12/13 through 6/15. Manitou was a relief from the nazi stronghold of CS! LOL!

Ill assume he made the casket.

Correction: Rosalie was 76 as of that letter being written in August. Now, she's 77. Well, Jesus was a carpenter too.

May she live long and prosper. Heck, shes done a remarkable job hammering coffin nails into twi's casket. Heres to many more years of "service"

Nice to see you Tonto! Didn't know you lived in Manitou. I lived in the Springs and went to Manitou often. Great town! I also visited the ole seminary. It's now a bakery and bed and breakfast. Was T-Bone with back in those daze?

Snippets from the seven-page letter to BOD August 2016: For those in their retirement years........imo, they were disturbingly irked by the cult lording over them. Damn.......who are these people [bod] to stand over us and try to plug us into ANOTHER PROGRAM during this "emeritus way corps status" time of life? That's what a cult does..........drive you to compliance, or drive you out. That's why years ago, I started this thread.......TWI's Corporate Secret The cult is relentless in its demands. There is NO COMPASSION from the puppeteers......just because you're 70 yrs old. C'mon man, get to cracking. Look at Rosalie at 76 years old......and she's still serving (cough, cough).

Phenomenally normal. The only thing missing is listening to some good country music. But everything in moderation, you know, because if you listen to way too much country music then eventually you will have to listen to it backwards so that you can get your car back, your house back, your girl back, and your job back.

And i find that inspiring!!

Oh, yes. I mean there's no telling what spiritual enlightenment I might have experienced on that Q & A session. I mean, look, it's inspiring Rocky to come up with ancient Greek fable paradigms and all.

wow, and I was stupid enough to think sex was for marriage. And that drugs were wrong. Didn't partake in either. Damn

Like I said on the other thread that referred to this letter, the delusion continues. For one thing, the "accuracy of The Word," is a mirage. If you don't believe that, try looking at any number of different versions of the Bible and see the differences. It's pretty obvious to anyone who reads carefully. To me, this letter is evidence that the signers are so enmeshed in the ideology that VPW dreamed up, I doubt they will ever change. But I am proof people can extricate themselves and really change, so I can't predict what will happen with these folks, despite the decades they've invested. I can tell you that in about 1998 or 1999, I contacted Do+tie Mo*nihan, who was at the time the Limb leader of Florida with her husband, Bob. I had found their phone number in the telephone book (ah the pre-internet days, at least for me). I was divorced, attending college, and working full time. I had been out of TWI for more than 10 years. The reason I called was to ask how her experience in graduate school for mental health counseling had helped her help people in TWI. I was considering going into that field. I also wanted to find out how she could justify continuing with TWI knowing of its extreme problems. At the time LCM was still president. She met with me, but she had asked if she could bring another 3rd Corps grad, a TWI-ordained woman with her, someone I had known over the years, too. Understand, I had not seen either of these women since 1987 at HQ just before I escaped. I said sure, bring her. We met in a café in Winter Park, FL. During a friendly, but surreal conversation, at least for me, I asked Do+tie why she had stayed with TWI. She said she wanted stand with her ordained husband. She also said she was a simple believer. Let the research be done by others, she would believe it,. like Uncle Harry used to say. It was then I told her flat out that TWI had never been a research ministry. I had been on the research team, which she knew because she was at HQ when I resigned from the team. I told her that "The Word" was whatever Wierwille said The Word was. Period. She looked shocked. She turned to her friend and they exchanged a glace I knew too well. I'm sharing this because it is not news to at least one of the signers of this document (Do*tie) that The Word was of Wierwille's making, yet she and the others persist in their delusional beliefs about Wierwille and the Bible. Those two things combine to make a strong tonic. In my view, this letter is proof of mind control if there ever was proof. Any ideology that tells you that your feelings do not matter, only The Word matters (which VP said all the time) is abusive. No one deserves to be abused. No one. People who were abused and continue to rationalize it, continue to name it something else, continue to dismiss it, will only continue to perpetuate it. What I recommend is that we keep sharing our stories here. You'd be surprised who might be reading them. There is another way of life, a better way, than offered by The Way International. We need to share our stories with our children and grandchildren. I can't tell you how many second generation Wayfers (or who they are) have contacted me about my story in Undertow, thanking me for shedding light on TWI, telling me it has helped heal them. If TWI was so great, then why do they need healing? Why do we need healing? Isn't it a pity that it's all come to this? That VPW's legacy is pain, confusion, and destruction? My hope is that the generation my daughter is a part of will someday see these GSC posts and learn from them, look through this window into their parents' pasts and understand the seriousness of mind control and its collateral damage. Sadly, they are a part of it in some form or other, some more than others, but many are still in denial just like their parents. Spread the word about helpful resources. I'm hoping to be part of a healing solution, which I think involves serious education. In my view, one of the best books for understanding all this is Bounded Choice by Janja Lalich. To those interested, you can check out Lalich's book and others at your local public library. In 1987, libraries were the immediate source of my healing. Then came people I could trust who did not have any stake in my life other than to encourage things that served my best interest, not their ego. Cheers, Charlene Lamy (former married name: Bishop) Edge former marked and avoided 2nd Corps Grad

Just had an amusing thought. How the f is jydl gonna rally the troops? His public speaking skills are on par with rivenbark's - a real yawn fest. Nothing to follow nothing charismatic. Egads!

Yes, how did it go ? I'm about to hit donate button as I believe GSC is still needed, vital,illuminating and informative.!!!

Ladies and gentlemen, I'd like to report that I'm still alive and well . . . even after leaving TWI. It's been a while, but I went and got myself into debt (a mortgage) and I've started going to college. To top it all off, I sporadically attend various churches in search of a church home, BUT (this is gonna freak everyone out for sure) I don't tithe. And, you know what? Once I got over the whole idea that I was "no longer under the protection of the household" I've been able to live my life and realize that it's infinitely better without TWI. In fact, as I write this, I know for certain that I've had more than "2 drinks".

How did we do, Raf?

I'm paid on the 20th, as well. See you then. :-) George

I tried clicking on the link I posted earlier, and a message came up saying there is no such page, So I'm copying the file here: What IS speaking in tongues? © copyright 2017, Stephen L. Lortz, permission to copy for non-commercial use, steve.lortz@gmail.com Speaking in tongues is the free-will[1] thank offering[2] of the first fruit[3] of the Spirit,[4] whereby people give back to God of, and in proportion to, that with which the LORD has blessed them;[5] the gift which is the Spirit that was promised for the last days,[6] the first installment and pledge of the Spirit of resurrection life[7] which we will all receive at the ingathering.[8] Speaking in tongues is a private prayer made to God through the joint cooperation of the believer and the Holy Spirit.[9] The primary purpose of speaking in tongues is to enable each and every Christian to offer perfect praise and thanksgiving to God in their private prayer lives,[10] despite the unregenerate hypocrisy that will continue to mar our hearts until Jesus Christ returns.[11] A secondary purpose of speaking in tongues is to demonstrate that God really did raise Jesus from the dead.[12] A third purpose is to permit the Spirit to make intercession for the saints, since we are not able to picture what we should pray for as we ought.[13] A fourth purpose of speaking in tongues is to build up the confidence of the Christian speaking in tongues that they do indeed have Christ in them, the hope of glory.[14] A fifth purpose of speaking in tongues is to serve as a sign that a person is a member of the New Covenant community[15] Since speaking in tongues is a free-will thank offering, it has to be the result of the mutual agencies of the speaker and the Spirit. The speaker has to will to speak, to voluntarily move their organs of speech to produce sounds. When the speaker does so, the Spirit gives the utterance.[16] For a Christian to be able to speak in tongues in their private prayer life is not a gift in the sense of a present wrapped in a box, that some Christians get and others do not. The “present wrapped in a box” is the Holy Spirit itself, and every Christian gets it.[17] When a Christian speaks in tongues in the assembly, with interpretation for the up-building of the people,[18] it is a gift in the sense of a favor done by the Holy Spirit for all the people there.[19] Not everyone speaks in tongues in the assembly.[20] Every Christian can speak in tongues in their private prayer life.[21] Genuine biblical speaking in tongues is in no way, shape or form ecstatic utterance. It does not spring from, nor does it produce an artificially altered state of consciousness in the speaker, even though on two occasions it altered the state of consciousness of the hearers.[22] Whenever a person speaks in tongues in public, it should be done decently and in order as described in 1 Corinthians 12-14.[23] The only imperative directly associated with speaking in tongues is 1 Corinthians 14:39b, “do not forbid speaking in tongues.” [1] Deuteronomy 16:10 [2] Leviticus 22:29 [3] Exodus 34:22; Numbers 28:26 [4] Romans 8:23 [5] Deuteronomy 16:10 [6] Acts 2:16-21 which quotes Joel 2:28-32a [7] Ephesians 1:14 [8] Exodus 23:16; 2 Thessalonians 2:1 9 John 4:24 [10] 1 Corinthians 14:2a, 14, 16, 17, 18 [11] 1 Corinthians 13:8&9, 15:51&52 [12] Acts 2:32&33 [13] Romans 8:26-28 [14] 1Corinthians 14:4, 22, Jude 20 [15] Philippians 3:3, Acts 10:45, 11:15-17 [16] Acts 2:4, 2 Corinthians 3:17 [17] Acts 2:38 [18] 1 Corinthians 14:13-17 [19] 1 Corinthians 12:4 [20] I Corinthians 12:30b [21] 1 Corinthians 14:5 [22] Acts 2:12, 10:45 [23] 1 Corinthians 14:40

Count me in as well..

thanks for keeping Grease Spot alive and well...Tonto and I donated to the cause.

Just donated!