Leaderboard

authorization to deploy Stealth Bomber Grease Spot One on TWI

I haven't been on Greasespot in... what has it been... about two years? The other day, I became curious about what TLTF and STFI have been up to. After going to their websites and finding nothing but the expected boilerplate yada yada, I came here to this thread. Needless to say, DWBH never disappoints! Between 2003 and 2008 I taught Humane Letters at a classical academy, and from 2011 until 2016 I was doing post grad work in theological studies. I originally went into the post grad work to get formal accreditation to teach and to pick up Greek as a subject I could teach at a classical academy. So... even though I will not be able to complete my masters due to health problems... I have taught professionally, and I have studied under actual professors! My scholarship has been informally recognized as sound by professional scholars. The CES boys, for all the writing and "classes" they churn out, are nothing but rank amateurs who lack genuine self-awareness. The reason they don't dialogue with others in the field of theology is because, if they did, their own ignorance would be shown for what it is, and they would have nothing... and I mean NOTHING AT ALL... left. The whole idea of a recorded "class" such as PFAL or its legion of knock-offs is bogus. A "class" in which the students can ask no questions is not a real class. During a class the instructor uses the students' questions as feedback to gauge how well she or he is communicating. I have taken several classes for credit that were recorded, and I always had to keep a log of questions to be reviewed by the professor who was overseeing my work, as well as to write a final paper. I have had to take two semesters over again because hospitalizations interrupted my work. I have had the same classes taught by the same professors, and I can say for a surety that no two classes are ever identical. The understanding of an actual teacher grows, and that growth is reflected in how the class is taught. The lack of ability to reflect growth is one of the huge drawbacks to recorded classes. I used to know John Lynn as well as any of his thousands of "closest friends" did. I liked his public persona and relied on his leadership after The Way International went to pieces. After Momentus, he lost whatever shreds of humility he had left. Theologically, he is stuck in a dead end rut. He is not serving Jesus or the Word of God. He is serving his own arrogance. I am sorry to hear of his physical problems, having a few of my own, but it astonishes me that he relies on quack medicine as much as he does on quack theology. I've got some comments on the REV, MRAP, but I'll post those on your doctrinal thread! Love, Steve

Insert: If I could go back to the beginning of this thread, part 1 of my "book" would be...... We Thought We Were Free *From the book "They Thought They Were Free (the Germans 1933-45)" by Milton Mayer. "Each step was so small, so inconsequential, so well explained, or on occasion, 'regretted,' that unless one were detached from the whole process from the beginning, unless one understood what the whole thing was in principle, what all these 'little measures' that no 'patriotic German' could resent must some day lead to, one no more saw it developing from day to day than a farmer in his field see the corn growing. One day it is over his head." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Still Contemplating The "Book" Title: And yes, I'm shamelessly milking this for all it's worth. This will never see a publisher's desk. LOL

The Pregnancy Policy What kind of board of directors legislates pregnancy policy to their employees? Forget diving into all the details......what gives them the right to insert when a couple should or shouldn't get pregnant and have children? Craig, Don and Howard all signed off on this? Doesn't this policy obliterate all kinds of issues about a woman's right over her body and conception? What about legalities? Is this even legal? [And please......don't start a legal-issues argument on this thread. Thanks.] Did this kind of thinking and policy connect all the way back to victor paul wierwille? Yep. It. Was. A. Cult. The Pet Policy On this one, the first sentence, the foundational directive..........Effective March 25, 1998, larger pets ("serious pets") such as cats, dogs, horses, reptiles and some birds will not be allowed by full-time Staff. Of course, when my wife and I read this, "Who has horses or reptiles or birds?".........but I digress.... The bigger issue, the MAIN POINT is......What gives the trustees the right to give these orders that affect our lives? Did every financial issue connect back to the needs-basis doctrine of wierwille......or what was it? NOW, it was personal. We had a dog, a rescue dog....a poodle mix. Our older son had turned 12 years old and summer was near. My wife was deeply involved in this and knew, with that deep-instinct of a mother's love, that our son needed the companionship of a young dog. Not a puppy with all its early needs, but a one-year old rescue dog from the shelter. A very dear and long-standing family corps woman, Jean G!les T0mko (mother of Paul G!les...corps grad) was like "the grandmother" that our boys never had encouraged it as well. [Note: My deprogramming episode was STILL rippling out its effects.....our two boys never really had that son/grandparent relationship.] Jean and her husband (a wonderful military veteran) through the years offered to babysit our boys several overnight weekends (Sat/Sun).....it blessed them immensely and my wife and I felt is was deeply healthy for the boys. Anyways......nine months prior to this "pet policy" my wife, son and Jean had gone to the rescue shelter and brought this dog home. Jean insisted on buying several dog items, because her heart was invested into our growing boys. She was, again, "Grandma" to our sons. When this policy went into effect, we had to get rid of this dog. My little twelve-year old son's heart was crushed and he sobbed for days while we looked to find a new home for his "little companion." Jean, too, was deeply saddened by this whole ordeal. The rippling effects of this pet policy on my family brought a deep, profound sadness to my heart.....opening the passageway to the haunting memories of my captivity, and my mom and dad. My son who had this growing desire to be a veterinarian.......floundered in this emotional turbulence of losing his little dog, Sandi. **Fast forward to leaving this cult........ into the years ahead, and now 19 years later: Our son graduated from college summa cum laude Received the chancellor award in medical school Selected as one of eighteen in nation for one year, intern yr, at sloan kettering (manhattan) Received intern of year award of those 18 Today.....a brain/spinal oncologist in top-tier cancer hospital So, readers......please indulge me as I pause..................to give a one-finger salute to the cult puppeteers, past and present.

The announcement that you, Jean-Yves, will be twi's next president has reached GreaseSpot Café. Knowing you from those early days in Quebec City, and your WOW year in Toronto.......I am not surprised that you rose up thru the ranks of leadership. Clearly, in your former years, you had discipline, drive and heart-felt compassion for others. When you were assigned to one of Toronto's WOW teams, I personally made sure that Rene and Sonia [ if I remember her name correctly] were in your WOW-family.....Rene needed extra attention being wheel-chair bound, and Sonia was so innocent, lovely and beautiful that I knew you'd be the right person to help them. And, after your in-residence year......I was honored to perform your and Michele's wedding in 1988. As twi continued to endure Chris Geer's call to "return back to the wierwille-indoctrination doctrine" with his arrogance assertions......twi went thru turbulent times, for sure. Martindale, Don and Howard were thrown back on their heels and were reeling in a defensive posture for a number of years. During this time, you and Michele were staffers at headquarters and saw much of the destruction of people's lives. Yes, for 28 years......you have been intricately ensconced at the upper-tier levels of twi-hierarchy and groomed by "leadership" at hq and therefore, removed from understanding the emotional, physical and spiritual abuse that has been thrust upon the followers. I am saddened, Jean-Yves, to see that you never connected the dots of this abuse and evil. The scriptures give us wholesale examples of how the Pharisees burdened the people with guilt, shame, and fear to maintain their positions of power. You see, Jean-Yves.......there are reasons why some 480 clergy and 3,000 corps grads no longer follow the doctrine or tenets of wierwillism. The mog-doctrine was a fraud perpetrated by wierwille to enrich his power base and control over the youth. Even back then, the older folk were abandoning him left and right......as even wierwille had noted that time and time again. And, when wierwille schemed to offer the sunset corps an "opportunity" to build a cabin at their expense at Camp Gunnison [that twi would later inherit upon that person's death]......NOT ONE ELDERLY CORPS PERSON bought into it. Notice how the elder corps were skeptical and suspicious of wierwille's shenanigans.....even though they were "corps trained?" Clearly, the days of Rosalie's tenure as president has been little more than manage the perceptions......after all, twi really doesn't have a research department any more, do they? And, the teachings are bland regurgitations that were scoffed at even by wierwille's pfal class renderings of religious veneer. Why would a "spirit-filled believer with all power" NEED to read his/her sermon? And then, is there really any full-sharing fellowship going on......or are people just going thru the motions? I think, if you were really honest......you know the answer. So....its not really a "Research, Teaching and Fellowship Ministry" is it? Perhaps, you will slip into the big chair and be able to make BIG CHANGES during your tenure......to elevate Jesus Christ in his rightful and honored place as lord, savior, and mediator between God and man. Perhaps......you will turn the ship 180 degrees and get back to true Christian values where believers are guided by holy spirit within. Perhaps.....you will be able to clean the ranks of arrogant and abusive leaders that have sat in their seats of power at headquarters for 30+ years. But if you are going to make any difference whatsoever......you will have to keep Rosalie and Donna from whispering in your ear on a weekly basis. All the best to you, Jean-Yves. Just know that "the power of that office" is not of any significance in the sight of God......UNLESS you use it for good, to unburden and heal the brokenhearted and those [still] in captivity. [Luke 4:18] .

Been reading here lately and in correspondence and thinking a bit. It's all very well having meetings in the home - "home church" - good idea, keeps things intimate. Too intimate. I imagine the original idea was to avoid shelling out $$ for meeting rooms or building places (like church buildings!). But meeting in the home had a dual purpose. Think how lovey-dovey everyone was. Greeted with hugs and kisses, despite not knowing the greeter well and perhaps despite one's own personal reservations. Everyone squished on couches or chairs during fellowship, and again after fellowship when things might be more relaxed. There came also more hugs and the back rubs and shoulder rubs, in sympathy or whatever. All this can be nice, can be friendly. It was a sort of enforced intimacy that could be manipulated by some. Everyone wanted to be round a charismatic leader. But what if that charismatic leader had other ideas? In the "group hug" on the couch, ostensibly putting arms along the couch back, perhaps, then allowing them to stray onto the shoulders of young women? Seeing who shied from that touch and who didn't. The occasional "accidental" brush of the hand in an inappropriate way. A too-long hug when people were leaving. And then, at bigger fellowships, everyone was used to this behavior because it had become the norm. So on coming into contact with the more rapacious type of leader - well, the softening up had already taken place. Rather than "promoting harmony in the home," I'm coming to the conclusion that meeting in the intimate home setting, where people's guard is down somewhat, was the start of the grooming process for the sexual abuse for young women. A lot of this unwanted touching just wouldn't have got started, would have been rejected earlier, if meetings had taken place other than in homes. Who smooches up like this in a church? In a meeting in a public room at the library or town hall or school hall? In a park or beach meeting? Thoughts, anyone?

There is still more to come........."the other bookend" ......the 2-hour confrontation with the region coordinators ......the grueling emotional agony of extricating ourselves from this cult ......the haunting turbulence of the past (1981 -- captivity) mixing with the present (1998 -- extrication) ......different sets of circumstances.....different sets of anguish ......OMG, why am I even going into this dark cavern to share this damn story, anyways?

Some thoughts regarding Schoenheit's REV: In the 1600s, Descartes proposed an idea as the very basis the scientific method, to begin by finding a fundamental truth (which was assumed), to proceed by the use of logic to come up with hypotheses, further possible truths, and then to find ways to test the possible truths against objective reality. Only when these tests succeeded would the new truth become established. In the early 1800s, German theologians were able to institute a department of theology at the new University of Berlin only by promising that their theology would be "scientific." This led to the "higher criticism" approach to interpreting the Bible. Because the science of the 19th century was deterministic, the fundamental assumption of the liberal protestant theology that followed was that every reference to the "supernatural" in the Bible was fiction. No hypothesis of the new theology was testable against objective reality (the text of the Bible) because the text was a priori NOT TRUE. The fundamental assumption of the conservative reaction to liberalism was that EVERY reference to the "supernatural" in the Bible is literally, historically true. This is called "inerrancy", and is the fundamental "truth" of "fundamentalism", which changed its name to "evangelical Protestantism" in the 1920s. Both liberal and evangelical protestant theologies are based on Descartes' idea that truth can be found by logical manipulation of a fundamental truth (assumption), but theology, as opposed to science, does not accept appeal to objective reality as a criterion for determining which ideas are true and which are not. They both rely on logic alone. Both approaches lead to what is known as "systematic" theologies. A systematic theology is one where the logical system of interpretation takes precedence over the text. Systematic theology says "The few difficult verses must be interpreted in light of the many clear verses." As some of us may well remember, this was one of Wierwille's favorite aphorisms. In contrast to systematic theology stands "constructive" theology, where the text takes precedence over the system. Constructive theology says "The fact that a few verses seem difficult means that your understanding of the "many clear verses" is not complete. Constructive theology tests the value of a proposed interpretation against the objective reality of the text! Schoenheit's REV is not just bad theology, it is TERRIBLE theology. It would and should FAIL in any formal academic setting, or even as a presentation at a Society of Biblical Literature meeting. The SBL is a club for Bible scholars, and it's annual conference is very much like GenCon is to gamers. Wierwille's logical system was based on two fundamental assumptions: 1) plenary verbal inspiration (inerrancy of the original texts, to which we do not have access) and 2) the dispensationalist assumption that on the day of Pentecost the Church was a wholly new thing, completely separate and discontinuous from Israel. Instead of approaching the text itself to see whether or not the things Wierwille had taught were true, Schoenheit doubled down on Wierwille's erroneous "administration of the mystery", transforming it into GOD'S SACRED SECRET! How often have I heard the CES boys say or write "logic dictates that..."? The REV is NOT a new translation. Schoenheit found a version of the Bible that was in the public domain so that he wouldn't have to do the actual work of translation. All Schoenheit did was to add a whole bunch of scholarly sounding but irrelevant notes, and to change the "few difficult verses" to line up with his particular system. Schoenheit did not translate, he CORRUPTED the text he plagiarized. That is dishonest scholarship as dishonest as it comes. I don't think it was malicious, but as every professional scholar knows, plagiarism doesn't have to be malicious in order to be dishonest. If you enjoy reading the REV, that's a wonderful thing, though not on the same level of scholarship as the Scofield Reference Bible. Scofield did not change the wording of the text to line up with his system. At the School of Theology we use the NRSV for the sake of uniformity, but all the versions have their own strengths and weaknesses. Love, Steve

Part VII Sprinting Thru The Finish One of the golden nuggets I pocketed thru the years came early in my life from my track coach. I had spent my junior year of high school on the golf squad, but decided to "run track" my final year. Team sports were my true passion, but thought I'd give this a shot....what the hell, I'd be graduating in three months anyways. The practice sessions were grueling, getting into shape, stretch exercises and running sprints. But as the competition meets fast approached, the focus got more intense each day. On this particular day, the coach told me to go to the 220 yd (200m) starting blocks with the others....and he'd time us. With the sound of a whistle we shot out of those blocks, sprinting around the curve and gutted for the finish. Many of us literally stumbling across the finish mark. As we caught our breath, the coach walked briskly to us, "You don't just run to the finish line, you run thru it!" From May to August, the limb coordinators and corps, those who were left, were assigned to help oversee four weekends of martindale's new wap-advanced class.....the culmination of a series that was two years in the making. These weekends would be synchronized across the country in succession......no advanced class grad would learn these truths ahead of the others. Everyone had been processed thru the other classes and the upgrades to live in this new prevailing promised land....and now, this would be the final bridge. It was as if every corps and every advanced class grad were summoned to the track, to cheer on this running of martindale's summit noblesse. Unbeknownst to my wife and me, our four final months in twi were stretching out before us as we rounded the curve. Like running track, the specifics that whisked by had little meaning. My focus was on staying in my lane and rounding the curve......intense, laser-focus. All my life I'd been running.....I loved it as a child when we played "tag" at recess. At night, on the farm we had this game called "flashlight tag." Two teams with like 3-4 in each group and everyone had a flashlight.....one group had to count down from 30, facing away with eyes closed while the other group ran out into the dark, to hide behind buildings, haystacks, farm implements, fence rows, etc. Then, the search group had to find each one in the dark and "put them in prison"......a big round diameter by the pole light. Once caught, you had to stay in that "circular prison" until you were "tagged out" (and free to run and escape into the dark) by another in your group. If everyone was caught and put in the circle, the game was over. And, the game started anew.....the "chased" were now the "searchers." Perhaps, those childhood games had some meaning throughout the longevity of life. Running was everywhere. Nearly every team sport imaginable (except golf), involves running.......football, basketball, soccer, volleyball (not so much), but still....lots of sports. Fans seem to like it as well. Otherwise, what's the point? Sure, there's blocking, tackling, throwing precision passes, and spectacular catches.....but the fundament reality of running makes the game move. Heck, I'd even taken an interest in distance running for a couple of years. Twenty-six miles is a long way to run. Many have written books about those adventures of 26.2 miles of brutal pavement-pounding. Some go on for decades dedicated to a world of running marathons....adorning their offices and dens with pictures, medals, achievements and stories. Running was everything to them. I found myself running to serve, running classes in six different states and in canada. What had I accomplished? Should I adorn my life and memories with those achievements.....commending myself for perseverance? I think not. It filled much of my life with activity, but what was I accomplishing? I guess I'd been running all my life. Maybe....it was time to stop? Those last four months in twi, I could fill in plenty of details....but it will always be the people that I remember the most. Not the grouping and herd-labeling of names....ie. corps grad, corps alumni, adv class grad, or the more poignant labeling like "active corps, dfac (dropped from active corps), or any grouping of the cult hierarchy.....but individuals whose lives ebbed and flowed with the realities of life. We were connected to their struggles, their families, helped them load moving trucks, waved as they drove away and yes, cried together at the funerals. We were connected. Yes, it was a cult......but we were on the same ship, much by happenstance moving thru the night. If "brevity is the soul of wit".......then I'd better be closing in on the finish line. I've had my time in the sunlight, to share my story......and all of you have been so supportive, understanding and gracious, standing alongside the track while I've run this leg of my race. Your support summons other memories. My senior year of high school, the mile relay was my favorite......four guys, four laps. Each one in my memory, each had his own lap to run.......1) Mark S., 2) Skyrider, 3) Allen T. and 4) Kent K. The uniqueness with each is a connective-ness of memories that only I hold: Mark --- ran the first leg. Born on the exact same day as me in 1954. He died 9 years ago from a heart condition. Skyrider -- got baton, ran second leg. Headed off to college, twi, and hopefully I have a few more years left to live. Allen -- third leg. My best friend. Before going to the navy, he took me to a missionary and, I believe, I was "born again." Kent --- brought the baton home. He & I lived together for a couple of months while we pondered our ways forward after high school. I went off to college and he went back to the farm. He became incredibly successful -- 2 homes, corvettes and "car drag racing" is still his passion. Again......connectivity. The happenstance of life; the intertwining of circumstances. At points, there's connection....at other points, not. I've run my race thru life and I'm still running. The words of my track coach I still hear......"You don't just run to the finish line, you run thru it." Running with all of you GSC-posters has been a treasure-trove of memories as well. Many of you I hardly know.....yet, we're connected. We had traveled on the same ship and now.....gone on to live our lives. The internet gives us connectivity.....and I'll forever be thankful for that. Otherwise, how would I hear your stories, your viewpoints, your convictions and humor? And, I envy so many of you who have a much greater command of computer skills than I do. I'm still inept at so many things.....still recovering from detours and wrong exit ramps. Sometimes, late at night, I still find myself running into the dark.....wondering who's around the corner to catch me and "take me to prison." But when the day dawns, I'll start running again...... ~~~~~~~~~~~ Next: Part VIII The Two Bookends

Hey Twinky, What I think on this is that the fellowship in the home is a mixed bag. There is the intimacy side of it which is appealing. However, in general, it taught people to cross personal boundaries. People usually keep their lives and their families protected in their own home. But with fellowship in the home, and the love-bombing culture, I think what it accomplished is systematically breaking down personal boundaries. The fruit or result of this is you would see people very willing to comment on and control others in areas where they had no business - it crossed personal boundaries. Finances, child care, careers, sex, nothing was maintained as taboo for boundary crossing in discussing or controlling in another. I think the "touch" thing is kind of personal. Some people like to be touched, others less so. I'm more of the "don't touch me" makeup. I think though more importantly that the crossing of boundaries is what was set up there. And the mental conditioning to accept the crossing of boundaries passively without fighting. This produces an environment that is groomed for predators. And the Way had many predators. Many of them stayed hidden. Some of the worst were exposed, like Victor Barnard. People use and manipulate each other in the Way for more than just sex though. The caste hierarchy certainly shows a good element of the same type of behavior David Miscavage shows in Scientology with the propensity for abuse. And many other types of abuse. Boundaries. If you are or have been in the Way for a long time you might want to check yours. You may find they have been murdered by a hit and run. The murdered boundaries in the sexual category are especially egregious. They have caused documented suicides.

T-Bone.......could you make sure that authorization comes with top-security specifications for laser-guided missiles to directly fire on cult puppeteers only? Perhaps, using "eyes in the sky" ----- the drones?

Concluding Paragraph of Cost-Cutting Policies This one is too-rich to pass up.....otherwise, I'd skip it. The drudgery of looking thru this puppeteer policy paper is downright nauseating, but here is one last snippet: "If Way Corps are not energized ministers then they should not be salaried by The Way International. That's stealing." Now hold on one dad-gum minute.......I thought martindale's "revelation" to put all field corps on full-time salaried staff was from God? The corps were trained to be leaders, right? The corps were trained to be God's best, right? The corps were the "spiritual marine corps" dr. wierwille envisioned and trained.....handing down these secret truths to the next generation, those martindale had trained, right? So........was it revelation or not? Martindale blamed the corps. The conclusion of the whole matter.........started with an IF. I Never Thought Corps Were "Spiritual Marines" There is no way that I would try and dissect the whole background of this "spiritual marine corps" version that blathered forth from wierwille. But for many reasons, it had/has entered that cult lexicon and corps-bots ever since its narcissistic inception laid claim to a nametag. Suffice it to say, I was not one of them. I was known to carry the cult mantle on many things, but not this one. Twi has no rights even to use the "corps" terminology. The essence of the word, as I understand it, is an organized unit of the military. The men and women of the military who serve, and veterans who served honorably, have my utmost respect. Four years ago, I was given this book as a birthday gift.....and now, pass it on to you The Things They Carried. An awesome read.

And.....Since Family Is So Inter-Connected I would like to take this time to tell you about our younger son. Upon leaving Oklahoma, he was not a happy camper.....as his sports-world was left back there. He had resumed a much greater access to little league baseball, because we weren't rushing out the door to all-things twi. He loved sports too just like me....but since I'd married this 5'2" little woman, he had limited opportunities for growth or sports. You can't have everything, right? In middle school, one of his buddies who stopped over at our house one day was Sam Bradford. Yep, that guy......who, after we moved away....he went on to Putnam City North High School, OKC.....(the high school where our older son had been), six blocks from our home. Here in Indiana (yeah, just keeping some anonymity here......) younger son went on to graduate from college and then, married his high school sweetheart. We love her dearly....and so thankful she never had any involvement with any cult of any kind (lol). Both have good careers.....my son is a small business owner with two employees. And, together my son and daughter-in-law have the means, desires and opportunities to travel abroad quite often. Probably, just like many of you and your kids do. Anyways.....since I told you about my older son, I wanted to insert a small segment on the younger one. We are proud parents of two cult-free kids. I will always be thankful that they never had to run the gauntlet. So, again.......I pause..........if any of you have a pic of a two-hands, one-finger salute......this would be the time to insert it. Thanks.

And that would be God being kind to them... Chocky, your "news footage" well represents the wreck of Wayfers' lives after TWI and the "road to Damascus" that opened our eyes to the evil of TWI. Clearly JYdL hasn't had that epiphany yet. I knew JY and liked him, knew his wife a bit better, lovely lass. But I think the only way I could take JY seriously now, would be if he posted a public repentance on the TWI website in a prominent position, and wrote a letter of apology to people here and on other exWay sites. Not holding my breath for that.

I'm right there with you, Skyrider . . . Let the salutes begin!

Will you please allow me to join you in that one-finger salute to the cult puppeteers, past and present?

Oh man! I am (positively) overwhelmed, Skyrider, as I read these personal accounts of you and your family while in twi. I am finding myself experiencing so many personal memories of my own as I read your perspectives. What is happening mainly, though, is a really healthy and cathartic feeling of deep understanding within myself about my own time in twi. I am feeling a personal sense of liberation with every new bit of understanding that seems to come to me as I read your words! It's really a bit difficult to describe ... but the overwhelming result is a pure, positive catharsis! Thank you soooo very much for your generosity of spirit to take the time to share these personal recollections and experiences. Your sharing them is having a deep and positive impact on me. I feel so grateful to you!

I continue to appreciate your insight on the inner workings of twi. As they say... spot on. In every instance.