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I once asked Dr. Bruce Metzger what he thought of George Lamsa's translation of the Cry of Dereliction. He said, and I quote exactly, "Rubbish." He was well aware of Lamsa's work, and thought it corrupted by doctrinal biases beyond usefulness. I was next door neighbors with one of Metzger's best friends [N.P.] for years. My wife and I attended cocktail parties (lol) with him and Isobel often on F____r Road. Most respectable scholars believe it's an allusion to Psalm 22 and, if so, perhaps the gospel writer wants one to assume Jesus was eliding the salvific conclusion of that lament. Don't get your panties into a wad, real scholarship is grown-up stuff... not props for some imaginary, superman, historical messiah. My God, My God, for this was I spared... to be free of cult crap and stinkin' thinkin' (my cry of deliverance)

I don't often check my account setting here but today I did and noticed that two people have voted my post down. Why didn't they just spit in my face? A man profiteth little in his own country. I like conversing here and I even love my enemies... but again I think it is caused by the male dominated, hate the gay guy homophobia, that caused me to reject "the way" in the first place. I guess these homophobes expect me to just believe everything they say while they claim to deny blind faith. I have close to twenty thousand friends on other forums, and a group I created myself with eight thousand loving members from nearly every country in the world.... And they added themselves as friends AND joined my group... I think I know who voted me down too, but I refuse to think evil or retaliate in the same petty way.... I am a better man. I know my ideas are often fanciful, sometime unorthodox and even bordering on heretical but I am not vindictive, just sometimes verbally opinionated. I posted this in the doctrinal topic because that is the subject I usually post in anyway. If anyone cares about me even as just a human being please try and reverse these attacks on my character and vote me up to at least zero. I don't want to leave this world hated...

To me the scriptures describe them aptly as self deluded as you say. Do they recognize their actions? Since they are the ones deceiving themselves do they recognize that what they are telling themselves are lies? Do they recognize the true depth of what's going on? Another place scripture talks about it is "conscience seared with a hot iron". That would indicate someone is past feeling. There's a work of the flesh in the KJV called "menstealers" - which is more like traders in flesh or slave traders, which they do. I guess to speak about the topic rationally there are couple approaches: 1) Scripturally 2) Psychologically From a phsychological standpoint, if you study the behavior of predators, like serial killers, there is usually a progression involved, where the first evil acts performed there is evidence of a conscience and moral struggle, but later acts are without this. That perspective may apply also.

Hang in there, Doc. It really doesn't mean anything of any consequence. Speaking for myself, I hope you continue to post. I promise to read them all.

Hello Dr. Soul Searcher, I must say, I am not above being juvenile sometimes :).... I have run around the political forums before....undoing Sunesis negatives....and I don't even agree with her politics! I usually undo Love Matters or Rocky's negatives as well. I usually agree with them both politically. If I think a remark is particularly nasty.....or there is a one word answer with a gratuitous green mark...I may undo it. . . .but I have not given very many negatives that stand alone. I have accidentally marked my own post down before. . . . seriously....a couple weeks ago. This morning I undid another on Mstar's music post???? I used to un-negative Shellon's when someone ALWAYS marked hers down. She is a doll and full of some sound wisdom. So, I do use it.....but, I like the idea of stating a reason. Sounds good. I am game. Okay...Dr. WW had six green I gave him one this morning....now he is down to 4?

I thank all concerned parties for helping me cope with this kind of situation. I will not take it to heart any longer. I am rubber and they are glue... :) I know my heart and my capacity to love and I won't let my joy and peace be eclipsed by their immature and vindictive nature. I wish no evil will and in time they may sense my patience and compassion. Yes, I sometimes (maybe often) speak openly against the Bible but I do it with a desire to know the truth and not just believe it because someone else says so. I have no fear in putting God to the test... I am tired of the divisive nature of many of the scriptures (three religions killing each other for many centuries) and these people just prove my point about the dangers of how the orthodoxy has radicalized their minds. I am moving on and I will, take it as a compliment. THANKS! Yes, I'm making lemon-aid, extra sweet and the cherry pits I will plant in my backyard and try and grow a tree. Much Love DWW

I wouldn't worry about it. I post in the political forum and people don't like my politics. I have a terrible rep. All the ones in lockstep pat themselves on the back and give each other great reps - its comical. Really, don't take is too seriously :)

No digs at you. I realize you don't attend any sort of church, but geisha believes you need to in order to be a genuine Christian, and I was just trying to keep her honest when she uses flattering words like she said to you. She apparantly feels that is 'taking a swipe' at her, but I just feel that people should honestly communicate what they believe without flattering words.

Corporatism at it's best/worst whichever way your mind thinks.

No More I Love Yous Do be do be do do do oh Do be do be do do do oh I used to be a lunatic from the gracious days I used to feel woebegone and so restless nights My aching heart would bleed for you to see 1-Oh, but now I don't find myself bouncing home Whistling buttonhole tunes to make me cry No more I love you's The language is leaving me No more i love you's changes are shifting Outside the words No one ever speaks about the monsters I used to have demons in my room at night Desire, despair, desire So many monsters (rpt 1) 2-No more i love you's The language is leaving me No more i love you's The language is leaving me in silence No more i love you's Changes are shifting outside the words And people are being real crazy And you know what mommy? Everybody was being real crazy And the monsters are crazy. There are monsters outside (rpt 2, 2,...) Do be do be do do do oh Outside the words Annie Lennox

Carte blanche

Yeah I agree with your intent waysider. I was going to respond in like manner but figured it might be skipped over. Since he has not responded to me or any one in a conversational mood. Kind of funny that he needs help in his posts. I think he thinks we believe what the way taught. And he does not know why this site is here.

*** Speaking in Tongues. What it is for. 1. To edify you. I Cor. 14:4. Jude 20. 2. To speak to God divine secrets. I Cor. 14:2. 3. To speak the wonderful works of God. Acts 2:11 4. To magnify God. Acts 10:46 5. To pray perfectly. Romans 8:26,27. 6. To give thanks well. I Cor. 14:17. 7. To have the spirit bearing witness with our spirit. Romans 8:16. 8. To know you are a joint heir with Christ. Romans 8:17 9. To strengthen you with might in the inner man. Eph. 3:16. II Cor. 4:16. 10. To be a sign to unbelievers. I Cor. 14:22. Mark 16:17. 11. It is rest to the soul. Is. 28:11,12. I Cor. 14:21. 12. To bring a message from God or for God to the people. Must then be interpreted for it would be in public. I Cor. 14:4,13,27,28.*** edit: This post was only intended to be a point of reference regarding "Way Theology".

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Awe that is nice cman :) thanks Tonight i had the revelation that olives are round like zero and seeds I then googled "olives in the bible" and found this: by "wayne blank" :) http://www.keyway.ca/htm2001/20011020.htm

Chill out, Dr WW. My statement was a response to Composer. It had nothing at all to do with you. I'm just saying that if Composer is going to offer critique of various facets of Way doctrine, he should do a bit more homework so he can understand what he's analyzing. He obviously does not understand the Way concepts of SIT as private prayer, excellor sessions, believers meetings or the circumstances of session 12.

Composer introduced interpretation and then withdrew it to make an attack.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/37028677#37007230

I never said I subscribe to Way theology. What I am saying is that if you are going to have a legitimate discussion of Way theology, you should, at the very least, have an accurate understanding of the subject matter. You, apparently, do not.

What are you all talking about? :) When one speaks in tongues privately there is no interpreter... While we were being instructed in PFAL to speak in tongues we all just spoke out loud together. If I recall we did not officially interpret until the intermediate class.

Apparently you haven't done your homework. According to Way theology, the one who speaks in tongues does the interpretation of it as well.