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Since the internet is the powerful thing that it has become and for some, the only medium of communication with most beyond our own safe and comfy existing, I'm thinking how much of a good tool it is/can be. For me I just have to keep my fingers out of the way of the hammer. I'm a realist, no getting around that and I'd just as soon deal with fact straight up and head on and get it out there and dealt with. However, having said that when someone in a website I frequent (yes maybe even this one) says something that triggers something in me, it can be even more powerful. If I'm wandering around my fave parenting site and read an article another parent writes that reminds me of something or someone I haven't considered in years or longer, it can be very startling. Then I have a decision to make don't I? If it's a person I'm triggered into remembering, I can then either enjoy the memory as one of fondness or remember him/her as the douchenozzle they were. Can I say nozzle here? It's not always and necessarily a bad memory and I'm not without belief that it could even be good to dredge up some old crusty cobwebs from time to time. I attended a hypnosis gig once and while I was but an audience member, thankfully, it did cause me to ask, silently lest I be noticed and invited, does that stuff really work? If you ring a bell or the chicken clucks, is it possible that it could invoke in another something distasteful, painful or even funny? Is it fair to say "you reminded me, damn you" or do we simply accept that it's going to happen and therein have to decide what to do with it?

Hello, This is the Research Geek. I have not posted for a very long time, but I thought it appropriate to make a comment on this thread. Linda Z is correct. I was on the research team, but I did not work on the Aramaic project. Having read the entire thread, I must comment about the unfortunate firing of Joe Wise by lcm because he was "too academic". I have the highest respect for Joe and the rest of the Aramaic team who worked on the Aramaic reference books. The "too academic" really means that he and the rest would not compromise their academic standards to cowtow to the demands of the twi hierarchy that they not publish something contrary to that which was taught by twi. (For example, their conclusion regarding Eli, Eli lamana sabacthani does not coroborate Lamsa's Bible or what was taught in PFAL. They simply, honestly could not prove twi's position on that verse.) They were taught by the best in the field, Dr. Arthur Voobis, in Chicago. At the time, their work on the Aramaic NT was some of the best available. It is true that the books published are highly sought in the Academic community as reference books. It was really stupid that twi stopped printing them. It was a political decision, not a godly one... I do not know all the details but I would have no trouble believing that because twi stopped printing their Aramaic reference books probably was what prompted this other person that they are suing to try to fill the demand and publish his stuff. The Aramaic work published by twi was probably the greatest academic achievement of the entire existence of the twi ministry, outshining all their other books published, but because under lcm they really were not a "research ministry" as they claimed, they had no clue as to the real value of what their research team had produced.

Someone at STFI is mad at me.

Or how I must be feeling. I don't feel like moving on anymore. I had moved on and then you all had yet another crap-in-your-own-bed thing where I was called to remind everyone about my warning about how all this was going to happen because the wrong people were put in charge. IMO, pretty much everything about the organization is wrong, wrong, wrong.

And I think it's funny. It's funny because I got this private message telling me I was telling people things that weren't true, without telling me which part wasn't. So I have no idea what part she thinks isn't true. Here's the reality: some things I write about are my observations and my experience. Things I saw; things I experienced. How I felt about them then; how I feel about them since some time has come between me and the original experience. These are my thoughts, my experiences, and I am entitled to them. Feel free to have your own memories and experiences, but don't tell me how to remember mine, or whether or not I can talk about them. OK?

Yeah, it seems that way sometimes to everyone I bet. But I think that for the really important issues that it is in truth more perilous to stay wrong than to learn something and find out our assumptions were wrong. In that case, in the long run as I said, we get to live with having been wrong once.

Jeff, thinking about your post and reading it several times, it took me a little while to understand and finally get to the place where you said you can "at least know the risks" and then make your decisions. That's a good point and due consideration given where we've all been and why we ended up there. Or here, or over there.... For me, personally, the stuff I ended up in that took me to place(s) of lack of trust weren't without my own accountability and I accept that, even 15 years in The Way Ministry. So, having said that and understanding your point, I agree that we can take from those experiences and carry the learning into new and hopefully better instances, circumstances and experiences and follow the 'fool me once, shame on you...' standards. For me, it's an almost daily healthy practice to remember how much something hurt or recall how much I invested before I found the exit door. But that isn't without it's benefits too, eh? I'm also reminded that it's not just me who has to be cautious, but to remember that I, too, have to prove myself and that should be acceptable too. If I want others to know me, trust me, invest their emotions, perhaps. :)

Sorry for the confusion. To explain a little bit more; I believed in the beginning but while in the Way Corps there was so much that I didn't agree with and as the years went on I realized I believed less and less. It wasn't overnight but more gradual. For example, Craig waking us up in the middle of the night to teach us about devil spirits. I wasn't thinking to myself, "wow, this is really important stuff and that's why he thought it important enough to wake us up". I was thinking "this REALLY could have waited til tomorrow". As for what I believe now concerning devil spirits............. I believe that good things happen to good and bad people and that bad things happen to good and bad people. I don't believe in "devil spirits". Twinky, I hope that's a little clearer for you. But yes, I feel that I stuck around WAY TOO LONG!!!

That middle of the night strategy seemed to be quite popular in TWI. (We had them in FLO, as well.) Why?, I don't really know. Maybe it was to take people off guard. Maybe it was to frame the message in an aura of false urgency. Maybe it was because people are more willing to relinquish control of their logic and reason when they are sleep deprived. Personally, I think it was a method they borrowed from legitimate applications, such as the military, and exploited to their advantage. What I do know, from personal experience, is that it can prove to be very effective at squelching opposition.

Brave of you, Jeff,but what were you trying to do? Reduce some of the interest so that the the price would be driven down and there wouldn't be so much to purchase another property? The locals already knew it was a bad place to be. Sounds like the culties that you spoke to know in their hearts that what's going on is wrong but they don't know how to get out of it. Maybe you should have made up some "business cards" with the GSC website address on. Given them to the folks you spoke to. As a splinter group, it's the other side of their story, too.

Hi Tzaia, It seems highly unlikely to me that any former Wayfer that learns to think for themselves would end up in as bad a place as we were led to by TWI. You are right, critical thinking is not without peril, but I believe our inner sense of accountability concerning our mistakes is a lot easier to live with in the long run than living with ourselves when we give up our inner accountability to those who lie, abuse, and never allow themselves to be held accountable. In the latter case I believe that instead of closure all we will likely have is an open wound that will not heal....mentally speaking. Am I making sense? This can be a hard topic to keep clear and concise.

I'm struck by how we have to trust. If you and I are going south on our 127 highway here and I choose to pass you, I have to trust that you're going to notice my actions, not cut to your left in front of me and you have to trust that I'm going to complete the entire passing before I return right and we go along on our merry ways. I might never meet you in person, I might never know you, but I've chosen, at that moment, to trust you. And if I'm on 127 south, I've got my daughter with me, thereby changing the trust to a higher level of need. I went to my Chiropractor this morning and mentioned that I'd been in a roll over accident about 4 years ago and he was none to happy that I hadn't mentioned that before in his intake information to treat me. Was it because I didn't trust him with the information? Was it because I forgot? Yes, and my reasoning made perfect sense to me. But of people in my world that I might do well to trust with such trauma, it would certainly be him. Here we trust each other with TWI stuff, some daily understanding and learning, maybe a peek of private. We learn what works for us, specifically, and what doesn't, but we get to choose.

I do not have an internet web site talking about me and my life and what my job is. granted it isnt as fancy as the way and glamor is all in a perspective but they have had a bit of microphone in their face for years.... it is funny you should bring up the N word normal My boss asked me wanted I wanted as I was having amelt down at work I said I want "normal" he looked at my team leader who was laughing his azz off. I was serious. lol so what is normal exactly? I know I kind of feel sorry for them. but I do not want to know their money situation I might have some envy or something . lol

Had a TC who wondered out loud how fax machines worked and wondered how the paper ended up at the receiver's end of the transmission. She honestly thought that the paper went thru the phone lines. Same said TC asked for help moving. Was I ....ed when I found one of the many items we were moving was a @#$# rock collection. Several boxes of rocks. None of them were of any value or did they even know what they were - just thought they were "pretty". Helped one TC move and happened across his old record collection. Opened up "The Wall" double album to have a load of pot seeds, stems, and detritus fall to the floor. Um, yeah. Pass the Twinkies and Doritos. Was told on the WOW field to stop witnessing to people and work more so we could pay the bills that people had run up prior to leaving the field or being kicked off. Asked by the LC/RC of my area if I got any money from my mother when my dad died - "Didn't he leave you anything?" and when I replied no and that I really didn't care about that, I was told, "That's too bad he didn't love you enough to leave you something." (Incidentally, my parents' house was paid off and they were debt free but my mother couldn't earn enough to pay the taxes on the house so she sold it.) That same LC/RC had a major hissy fit because no one met him in the driveway to greet him when he came to twig to teach. He wasn't bringing in anything but his own fat @$$ and a briefcase. Meanwhile, we had 2 handicapped twig members who'd just walked in the door and a young child screaming for something (milk or juice I think it was...) so our attention was elsewhere - we didn't hear Rev. McDouchenberg pull in.... Oh well. Oh and there's more.... these are just the top of the pile of TWI excrement over the years....

I dunno.. just looking at it.. doesn't the organization itself appear for lack of better words.. "schizophrenic"? I'm not saying *they* aren't "nice people" or anything.. and the *organization*.. "firing" or having a "mutual parting of ways" with jl.. isn't that not unlike the Frankenstein monster strangling its own creator?

I dunno.. if one can avoid them.. I'll ask the question, why didn't you avoid them.. to which I would say.. I absolutely agree. maybe it just wasn't the experience one wanted, or expected.. well.. I won't say unexpected. Or unwanted.. at least personally..

I believe that each person who enters your life can provide a learning experience.

And that, my friends, is the entire crux of the problem of "Christian" organizations today.. Businesses.. That's all they are.. If they even hint at needing your money, run away, run away! The baby that cries the loudest get's the milk, but are they really the ones with the need? While real Christians are struggling with financial, marital, family, psychological problems.. Real problems! We instead support these business men. We need to learn to take care of those who have need around us first!!! I doubt you'll find a shortage if you just open your eyes! And if it isn't the Christians around you with need, is those that haven't found Him yet.. When all those avenues are depleted, maybe and that's a very small "maybe", there might be something to help these "business" men with a so called ministry.

Just bringing it back to the top. I was looking at a picture the other day of a whole gang of us 22 corps outside the dorms in gunnison. The sun was in half our faces and the shade was in the other half. I think it must have been the entire 22 corps. It was a seriously crappy picture and I can't remember who took it but I bought my copy for like 50 cents or something and back then, I thought the pic was so bad - what a waste of part of my $30 allowance and I'd better go write it down so I don't forget - ha,ha but I found that picture recently and I held it for probably 10 minutes just remember names and experiences and all the great times I had with some of these people. Some of it was so fun - snowmobililing, snowball fights, snowskiing (seeing a theme?) and some of it wasn't so much fun, does anyone remember the 5 mile hike in the snow up one of the mountain with Mike Anderson and Sue....can't remember her name or the early morning runs up to the water tower and up to the top of the commons - those stairs....yikes! It made me strong though. Anyway, so I'm holding this picture and I'm thinking how some of the time I was in the corps was probably the best time in my life and then I put the picture away remembering that some of the time.....was also (still to this day) the worst times in my life. Does anyone remember that picture? Who's the big guy - on the heavy side but really tall too - just a real big guy, anyone know? He was really cool.