vp and me in Wonderland

[WordWolf]

Hi there.

Those of you who tuned in and liked "The Way:Living in Wonderland"

may like this thread. That one looked at the book "the Way:Living in Love"

and the picture of Wonderland that it presented.

This thread will look at the book by lcm, titled "VP and Me."

Since my approach will be similar, I labelled this thread accordingly.

Now, then, this book was never released, not even to twi members.

The only "circulation" extant is the notes taken on this book by people who

were required to sit thru a "class" of its contents.

Therefore, we lack an ability to go over it line-by-line.

Thus, this can't be an "official" analysis of the book itself.

However, what we do have is a pretty complete set of notes,

from here:

http://www.greasespotcafe.com/waydale/corp.../vp-and-me.html

====

The setup and structure of the book and its presentation are

already listed there, so I won't repeat them here.

I WILL, however, quote some highlights from the book before discussing,

same as we did with the other thread.

Remembering that this book contains reminiscences of lcm,

and thus how lcm remembers things,

I think it can be another useful tool in viewing vpw AND lcm.

(So long as we remember that.)

=================

"Most of the incidents were not written down at the time of occurrencs in diaries. etc.

The book was written mainly from recollection."

1970-1971.

=========

"The first time that LCM saw Dr. was when he was a senior at the University of Kansas.

LCM went to twig first and found the teaching to be tremendous (electrifying).

Donny Fugit taught.

On Dec 8th 1970, Dr. Wierwille came to Laurence, Kansas to the fraternity house of Joe C**lt*r

to teach twi. LCM immediately recognized him as a 'great man.'

"LCM wanted to be right. Wanted to be convinced.

The next time LCM saw Dr was in Witchita, Kansas when he visited with Cl**d*tt** R*y*l.

When he was first introduced to Dr Wierwille, Dr said to him

'Hello-Well I have to go and eat this piece of cake.'

Dr W would meet with all the believers from each city at a time in a room in the basement.

All the Limb was there, but he'd meet with everyone branch by branch.

Dr asked for help whenever he needed it. He asked Donny Fugit a question

about something. LCM was very impressed and shocked that so great a man would

ask for help in front of others.

One day LCM received a copy of a letter that had been sent to his home address

(he was on a job elsewhere at the time.) The letter had been in response to his letter

about coming into the Way Corps. It was a couple of weeks old!

Across the top of the copy was written

"Either call Dr. Wierwille or forget it!"- Howard Allen.

LCM ran to the phone and called Dr Wierwille. Dr asked him if he would come to

summer school to see how he shaped up for acceptance into the corps. LCM said he'd

be there with all his money together, etc.

LCM had always planned on going into the Christian ministry with his church. but

after taking PFAL, he realized that he and his denomination no longer saw eye to

eye on issues. He wanted now to go Corps!"

June 1971: Heading to HQ.

============

"LCM showed up without all of his money together for summer school."

"After the service LCM went to Dr at the advice of Mrs Owens, and informed him that he

did not have all of his money together for summer school. Dr looked at him and then said

'You can stay as long as your money holds!' LCM really looked upon this as grace upon

grace and resolved never to go behind in his financial responsibilities. If he ever went a

day behind, he decided, he would leave."

"LCM was stunned to see Dr. mowing the lawn at HQ. HE was in his shorts! Surely a man

of God as important as Dr. should not have to do menial work like this. He should be

inside studying the Word!"

"That summer Dr taught the 'Athletes of the Spirit' analogy for the first time."

Fall of 1971.

==========

"Start of Corps training. 'Welcome home son!' Dr says to LCM after he gets back from a trip

to Oklahoma to see his folks. It was right then that LCM realized and decided that HQ was now

his home.

The very first corps night that LCM was ever at, Dr. showed everyone how to manage a 3 x 5

card file to help keep track of people's names, etc. LCM had expected a big heavy teaching

and was amazed once again at the stuff that Dr came up with, the practicality of it."

[A few months later] "Dr asked him while driving would he like to be the WOW coordinator

He said 'Sure' (gulp)."

"Commissioned the second wave of WOWs that year. LCM, now the coordinator, was asked if he

wanted to have breakfast for the WOWs before they left to go on the field. Not being a

morning-breakfast-type of person, and thinking that the ministry could save some money

instead, he choose to not have breakfast prepared for the departing WOWs that day.

The WOWs left before 7am that day with no food.

When Dr heard that he was very hurt. He asked at lunch who had made the decision to send the

WOWs away on an empty stomach. LCM put up his hand and admitted it was he.

The learning he got was that finances are not the sole variable in moving the Word. There are times

to spend and times not to spend. Being frugal is not the same as being stingy!"

=======

Next time we'll resume with "Location-South Trustee Office. LCM's 1st year in the Way Corps."

[GarthP2000]

One thing I see here IMHO, is that Craig must have been really desperate for a father figure.

Sad really. :huh:

[mstar1]

One thing I see here IMHO, is that Craig must have been really desperate for a father figure.

Interesting point, now that you mention it

I don't recall Craig ever once mentioning his real father.

Was his a broken family?

[WordWolf]

Location-South Trustee Office.

LCM's 1st year in the Way Corps.

==============

"Dr shared with them the example of two local businessmen who stayed their minds daily

for one houron their businesses to try to bring to pass the things they wanted to see

happen. That triggered LCM to start thinking about stayed mind and to start thinking

in terms of visual imagery."

"Uncle Harry and Dr W would sometimes argue with each other...sometimes in front of the corps.

But they always resolved the issue, and when the argument was over, they walked away with no

resentment or bitterness, etc. They would move on and stick with the decision."

"One meal time-Incident of the 30th anniversary banquet- Dr wanted all the men to dress in tuxedos.

Uncle Harry said that might not be the best utilization of the believers' money, having to rent tuxedos

or buy them, etc. 'Why couldn't people just wear nice suits if they had them?'

Dr erupted and said

'That's cause you just want to wear that calf-upset brown suit that you have and love to wear!'

Everyone blurted out laughing.

It was finally decided to wear tuxedos."

"I Corinthians 2:9-16.

This was when LCM learned the great concept of literals according to usage,

a research project of Dr. W's."

"Incident when Dr. W didn't know what to do about a WOW who had gone off her rocker.

LCM, on seeing how he handled the situation, learned from it that you take help from

people that you love and trust. You may not have all the answers yourself.

Dr had said 'I don't know what to do, Howard. Tell me what I can do!'

Dr later took the girl into his home for a few weeks and got her back to health."

"LCM learns about the athlete's analogy of staying at your prime physically and spiritually."

LCM takes over as 2nd corps coordinator.

====================

"Being a genuine student is an artform."

"LCM would picture himself doing what Dr would do in certain situations."

Location-Fountain & Garden of Living Waters.

============

"A leader is always trying to maximize time spent."

"If a student is genuinely interested in learning, he will take the admonition the

first time. It doesn't have to take multiple reproof sessions to get someone to

change, nor does it have to take years of trial and error."

Location-BRC.

June 1971.

=========

"2nd year in residence."

"As a teacher Dr took great joy in knowing that his students were learning."

"You don't look for negatives in people. However, you can't be blind to what's going on around you

either. There's a balance."

"Horse Sense is probably the greatest part of Corps Principle 1. Dr came to their trailer and started

pointing out all the details they were missing- broken door handles, window handles, etc-little

things that needed fixing."

"Learn to pre-think things. Example of log stumps. Don't pick them up and move them until you

know where their destination place will be."

"Dr would often be more excited about the way his students presented the Word than he would

be about his own presentations."

"Dr was thinking about Word over the World and the fine arts, etc. He had a great artist in to train

the corps people who had shown talent and interest in the arts. The guy never really took the ball

and ran with it, though."

"Dr told LCM

'We trust you to coordinate anything in the Way Ministry.'"

"Decision to send LCM on the field to expand his exposute to different situations, etc."

19 people in the 2nd corps.

===========

"Emotions never dominate the practicality of clear thinking and moving."

" 'You're the best- go get them!' -First time LCM heard Dr use that expression was upon graduation

from the corps and as he was being assigned to go to Oklahoma."

"Dr called LCM after 3 weeks on the field and asked him how come he hadn't called since he

arrived in Oklahoma. 'What kind of ego trip are you on?' "

"Dr always put the ministry ahead of himself."

"Time that Dr spent time with LCM's folks."

1974.

====

LCM teaches the ROA for the first time. The rain comes pouring down. Dr sticks his hand out from

behind the curtain and pushes him out into the rain. 'If the people are going to get wet, so should you!'"

Next time we'll pick up in

"Location: Under Mulberry Tree. 1974-1975."

==============

[templelady]

Not to derail but-there was a print copy of the book in the 80' I owned, at one time, both VP and Me and TWLIL> (back to packing)

[Rejoice]

In reading this, what I catch a glimpse of is LCM as a young man, who already answered the call of the Lord in his life. He seemed to want to do the Lord's will [at least in his 20's].

It's very possible that VPW took a very willing young man and poisoned the heck out of his brain, heart, and soul.

I'm not excusing what Craig became, but I don't believe he started out to be an evil man. He may have wanted to be right, not because of pride, but because he didn't want to make mistakes. That traight may have started in his own home growing up, but we'll never know.

[coolchef1248 @adelphia.net]

i am no fan of veepee but please let's not us lay the blame on him for loy's screw ups

[Rejoice]

Hi Coolchef;

Do you think that VP didn't have any direct cause and effect relationship with LCM?

[rascal]

Chef...who do you think taught Loy that he had to *loosen up* in the sexual areas? Yeah...he said that to lcm....who taught loy that he was entitled to anything he pleased......that *all things are legal to them which are in christ* ...who recomended that loy marry donna?

I think vp or his doctrines anyway had a heck of a lot to do with what lcm eventually became.....

[WordWolf]

"Location- Under Mulberry Tree."

1974-1975.

=======

"1st year of family in the Corps. The 5th Corps are in their 1st year of in-residence."

"LCM begins to lead and frequently run the SNS at HQ."

"He began to become a genuine teacher to the Way Corps. His year on the field had

helped him develop as a spiritual leader."

"One time Dr saw a piano placed on a piece of cracked plywood to protect the

floor. Must have looked crap because he got upset that people weren't taking care of

the place physically." "'You've got to fight for this place,' he said.

Tenderness and aggressiveness were exemplified."

"Incident of the guy in the 5th Corps dying as the result of a car wreck."

"The guy was buried in the Way Woods after cremation. Dr thought that cremation

was a very practical way to be dealt with when you die."

"Some in-residence Corps had approached Dr and LCM about the need to make

adjustments in the In-residence Way Corps training. They needed it to be easier as

they had families. Dr thought about it for awhile and then came back with his

response which was to back up LCM totally and tell the in-residence people that

if they couldn't handle the heat, then leave. LCM was very blessed to see that

Dr had backed him up and endorsed the way he was running the program."

"One time, a meeting was planned in the Way Woods and LCM was thinking

through getting Dr home after the meeting. He wanted him to be able to use his

golf-cart to drive home. So, LCM told a corps guy to go and take the golf-cart

and bring it to the meeting-place. LCM said that he would get the necessary

clearance from Dr Wierwille. He forgot to get the clearance, and the next time he

saw Dr, he was chewed out. Dr stuck his finger into his chest and said

'Keep your hands off my stuff.'

LCM apologized. He had slipped up and forgotten a detail and Dr was teaching him

yet again.

The only thing bigger in Dr's heard than people is the Word."

"After talking with LCM one day, Dr dismissed all the corps for bad attitude problems.

He told them

'Ok, as of right now, you're all out of the corps.'

He then made it available to all of them to reapply to him by filling out a 3 x 5 card,

The card had to express their willingness to obey leadership. Some of them

decided to leave rather than obey."

"As leaders in the ministry you sometimes can't get involved with everyone's

problems. You just don't have the time. Sometimes all you can do is be there for

your people in a crisis. LCM had a number of incidents where he hadnt been

aware of certain people having difficulties. He had felt foolish for not knowing about

it and not having been there to help."

1975-1976

1st year of Way Corps at Emporia.

===========

"Dr said to LCM: 'Now it's your baby. Keep it moving, have no regrets.'

One of the great learning standards-have no regrets."

"Some people claimed that the ministry was turning the Way Corps into

slave labour. They were working on getting Emporia into shape. Dr said to

LCM, 'People love to work, they love to invest their labor into a place they

have pride in.' "

"LCM finally decided he needed to get married. He goes to Dr and lets him know his

thoughts and seeking advice. Dr promised he'd look out for a good woman for him.

Later, LCM decided to marry Donna and immediately told Dr. Dr said

'She's a good woman' and then rode off quickly on his motorbike. LCM found out

later that he had gone at once to call Donna and talk to her to let her know and

understand fully what she was getting into with LCM. He was going to be a great

leader in the ministry and she had to be prepared to handle herself accordingly, etc."

"Donna was in residence at the time but Dr gave her permission to visit Emporia

frequently so that they could get started early on getting to know each other."

"One situation arose when LCM made a gift presentation to Dr but omitted to make

one to Mrs W. She was very embarrassed due to the breach in protocol. Privately,

the next day, Dr and Mrs W reproved LCM for the error. If you are going to lead

God's people, you cannot miss on protocol. It's representing God and the ministry."

Next,

we resume with "Location-House of His Healing Presence".

[frank123lol]

Hi,Looking on this,Where I am out of twi,I see a whole lot of the great precious mog being protected

and coddleled.Oh me me me I amm the great one and you will bow down.Kinda like how everybody treats

Tony Soprano.

[Sunesis]

I see a lot of naivety and hero worship in Craig. Especially in the beginning. Things like, oh wow, a rolodex, golly gee, Dr. is mowing the lawn! That truly is pathetic. Everything VP did was somehow so "spiritual." I don't understand why this inspired such awe in young men. Its got to be the father thing somehow.

As LCM starts getting more responsibility and realizes VP is going to back him up, he starts getting more cocky.

I heard him read this when he was made president. I thought it was one of the most blatent hero-worship things I had ever heard. VP was an idol to him - literally and figuratively. Its the same worship and devotion Hitler's men gave him. There's just something very unnatural and bizarre about it.

[Samurai]

Personally, I doubt the veracity of LCM's words. I think birds of a feather flock together.

Anyway, what I see is a not so cleverily crafted suck up brown nosing book that help him gain his position in the JR Ewing Oil Dynasty, oh, TWI and that he set a standard of if *I* looked at men of god this way, then certainly all you peasants out there should now look at me the same way, and btw, we don't do lawns, windows or dishes; the dirty work is for you.

It reminds me of it's successor, the Passing of the Patriarch, another crafted 'work' to connive others who the true successor of Way Land should really be. Did anyone actually get to study that paper as well or was it all spit out by some Mother Bird Rev. to have notes taken on it as well?

Edited October 24, 2005 by Samurai

[Ham]

LCM was very impressed and shocked that so great a man would

ask for help in front of others.

I'm SURE it did. Of course, it only contributed to his public persona..

As leaders in the ministry you sometimes can't get involved with everyone's

problems. You just don't have the time. Sometimes all you can do is be there for

your people in a crisis

My translation:

"As leaders in da ministry, despite all of your attempts at meddling with the piddly, insignificant crap in their lives, they often spurn your advances. You have proven yourself such a meddler in rumor and innuendo, that you simply do NOT have the time, no less the aptitude, to be involved in REAL problems. Hence, when your people are in a REAL crisis, they'd be better off if you didn't give a rat's foot"

LCM said that he would get the necessary

clearance from Dr Wierwille. He forgot to get the clearance, and the next time he

saw Dr, he was chewed out. Dr stuck his finger into his chest and said

'Keep your hands off my stuff.'

LCM apologized. He had slipped up and forgotten a detail and Dr was teaching him

yet again.

Ah.. if all else fails, yell, scream.. I wondered where he learned that one.. would seem someone so "spiritual" would recognize ole craigster's "heart to serve"..

imagine his fate if failed to provide for the old vicster's "comfort"..

Dr thought that cremation

was a very practical way to be dealt with when you die.

Wonder why it wasn't so practical, for himself..

Some people claimed that the ministry was turning the Way Corps into

slave labour

Seems people actually started waking up, even back then.. ah, the "good old days"..

LCM decided to marry Donna and immediately told Dr. Dr said

'She's a good woman' and then rode off quickly on his motorbike

And old vic knew this.. in more ways than one..

ginosko, you know..

[Ham]

"Emotions never dominate the practicality of clear thinking and moving."

Hogwash.

Emotions are SUPPOSED to GET STUFF DONE.. at least sometimes..

Sure.. I guess you are supposed to quote fifteen retemories to prove to yourself that you shouldn't feel bad because you just reemed some innocent soul five or six new holes.. go ahead and bury it somewhere..

"You'll be SORRRRRRRYYYYYY"..

Yep.. it'll be back..

If it was me, I woulda said "emotions are a necessary part, and TEMPER the practicality of clear thinking and moving..."

One situation arose when LCM made a gift presentation to Dr but omitted to make

one to Mrs W. She was very embarrassed due to the breach in protocol

I would imagine that that was just the tip of the iceberg..

here the lady is married to a stinking womanizing,abusive plaigiarst, probably one of the only few good folks in the ministry at the time, and she doesn't get squat. I would be, well.. furious.

Real love doesn't give a darn about "protocol".. I bet it really wasn't about all that..

The only thing bigger in Dr's heart than people is the Word

Explains a LOT.. ah, that's why he reemed loy and others like there was no tomorrow..

Makes me wonder how loy feels about all that "love" now. You know he's had to at least thought about it..

Same reason the extremists kill people today.. because they love "the word".. just a different bible, that's all..

LCM would picture himself doing what Dr would do in certain situations

That was the PROBLEM. Lest I repeat myself.. just read the three previous paragraphs..

[Jim]

"I see a lot of naivety and hero worship in Craig. Especially in the beginning. Things like, oh wow, a rolodex, golly gee, Dr. is mowing the lawn! That truly is pathetic. Everything VP did was somehow so "spiritual." I don't understand why this inspired such awe in young men. Its got to be the father thing somehow."

Exactly my feelings.

Craig gushing over how VPW used a stack of index cards to keep track of students. Wow, somebody's easily impressed. Reading this stuff again, I can't know whether Craig was writing it to fill space or he was truly impressed with the obvious....

[WordWolf]

1975-1976.

=======

"Dr presents LCM with a used Honda 350 to scoot around the campus on.

Dr took LCM out that evening to properly instruct him on how to use a

motorbike safely."

"Discussions with Dr regarding Corps with low levels of sponsorship. Dr allowed

LCM to sit with him for a week as he (Dr) talked with each corps person in

that predicament. Dr came up with suggestions to help people and

challenged them to figure out things themselves. He told the corps that

smoked that they needed to quit if they wanted to stay. The money they

saved could go towards their sponsorship. Dr required committment from

people. Then he helped them with their believing. He made smoking

agreements with a number of people."

"Later on that year, one of the people came to LCM to confess that they had

breached the no-smoking agreement. That spurred LCM to ask each one of

the people involved if they had kept the committment. Had they, at any time

since the agreement, had a cigarette. 15 of them said that they had smoked."

"After some careful deliberation, LCM dismissed the 15 from the Corps for

the breach. He felt he didn't need to ask Dr. W. for clearance. Dr had told

them they could stay if they hept their part of the deal. Once they broke

it, they had disqualified themselves.

Dr, upon hearing the news, agreed with LCM's decision but a few days later

decided to offer these people a new chance, He challenged them to get all

of their money together in one week and re-commit to the agreement if they

wanted back in. A number of them did come back in."

"Dr and LCM always fought for people to stay in the Corps.

There was an incident of a guy in the Corps who all of a sudden went

"gooney-bird". He started to babble and not make sense. LCM worked hard

with the guy to help him but he was incoherent. Dr, when he met him,

confronted him by asking- 'Son, how come you're letting your mind get

all scrambled?' The guy answered unintelligibly and Dr told him that it would

be best for him just to pack his bags and go home. The guy understood

that. He left.

LCM spent many hours and many long distance phone calls trying to make

sure the guy had gotten home from his bus ride home safely. Not being

able to verify his location, he was concerned. Dr told him to move on.

There's nothing you can do, he'll show up at home soon enough. A week

later the guy did show up at home."

"Dr began working and teaching the book of Acts verse by verse over the

next 2 years. He encouraged the corps to work the book of Acts from the

perspective of the 8 concluding statements that he laid out for them.

Dr had thrown out the ball as he so often did and LCM picked it up and

ran with it. The result was ultimately the 'Rise and Expansion' book.

LCM put in 8-16 hours per day for a week working the subject."

"The incident of 2 corps grads considering divorce. Dr called the husband in

in front of a number of the leaders and openly confronted him and

challenged him to keep his marriage together. Divorce is wrong.

What is love? The Word of God!"

"Dr was now teaching corps nights at HQ on Tuesdays, then right afterwards

he'd get on the coach and go to Emporia to teach the corps there on

Wednesdays. He did this for years. Just like in Acts 11- Antioch-

they had a new root locale."

Next time,

'August 1976- LCM and Donna get married."

[Ham]

Dr presents LCM with a used Honda 350 to scoot around the campus on

Something about this picture just doesn't look right.. for the life of me.. I just can't see loy scooting around on a motorcycle.. it would "ruin" his hair..

Perhaps his "father" wanted loy to adopt the same interests.. jeeze. Bad enough he took up all his other bad habits..

After some careful deliberation, LCM dismissed the 15 from the Corps for

the breach

CAREFUL deliberation??? I doubt it.

Dr, upon hearing the news, agreed with LCM's decision but a few days later

decided to offer these people a new chance

Ah.. more of the same old stuff.. "You're in, you're out. You're a speck of dirt in God's eye, you're the greatest" Again, and again, and again.. gads, they sure were masters at keeping people off balance..

There was an incident of a guy in the Corps who all of a sudden went

"gooney-bird". He started to babble and not make sense. LCM worked hard

with the guy to help him but he was incoherent. Dr, when he met him,

confronted him by asking- 'Son, how come you're letting your mind get

all scrambled?

I WONDER why. vic "confronted" the guy? Asking him WHY? The guy is incoherent for God's sake.. how is HE gonna know???!

I wonder how much it had to do with the freakin instability.. "you're in the corps, you're out. You're a pile of dung, you're wonderful. You're.."

Not to mention the diet there.. first gluttony, then starvation..

Probably would have made me incoherent too..

So much for being able to help somebody in a crisis.. just send them home.. unbelievable.

LCM spent many hours and many long distance phone calls trying to make

sure the guy had gotten home from his bus ride home safely. Not being

able to verify his location, he was concerned. Dr told him to move on.

There's nothing you can do, he'll show up at home soon enough. A WEEK

LATER the guy did show up at home."

Concerned. A godly attribute.. and vic just proceeded to beat the last shred of humanity out of ole loy.. "move on son, nothing more to see here.."

"There's NOTHING you can do". Really?

Seems this little lesson taught loy how to "handle" people.. just put babbling, incoherent people on a bus, put "disobedient" staffers and whole families in a Ryder truck with little or no resources.. no place to go, and no way to get there.. and not have even a tweak of conscience doing so..

I kind of wondered where he learned this..

[WordWolf]

August 1976-LCM and Donna get married.

1976-1977.

================

"Dr wants LCM to go on the field and promote the Way Corps. The way he wants him to approach

it is to try to scare people off the Corps program. Let them know how tough it is and how

committed they need to be."

"LCM and Donna leave on their trip and fail to say goodbye to Dr before they leave.

When they get back, Dr reproves them for the matter. He was genuinely hurt.

Dr always was thinking of his people."

"A corps girl escapes from the deprogrammers and makes it back on campus.

As she was brought into the meeting (as Dr had requested) where Dr was teaching,

he stopped and opened his arms for her. It was a very emotional moment.

Everyone was crying. Dr had her accompany him everywhere he went for the next few

weeks, to help her heart heal. He made her a part of his life."

PFAL 77

====

"Dr lets LCM teach to a huge audience. Even when you think that you know your material,

always work the Word and re-study the material before you teach it."

"Don't make decisions based on what you feel. Base your decisions on what people need.

Incident of Dr calling for a dance on the final session of PFAL 77. All the crew were tired,

but the need for the students was a dance. The dance turned out to be a major blessing."

"Dr developed the technique of wearing the microphone behind the tie. It had not been done

before in the secular world. Most thought that you couldn't make the voice sound authentic

enough when it is muffled behind cloth. Our ministry showed it could be done.

Dr was always thinking of ways to be better."

"While at PFAL 77, Dr walked up to LCM on-stage and said 'You're a great man!'

Dr, always the master of the one-liners."

Location-Way Corps Chalet. Back porch.

Jan 20 1982-Dedication of the Way Corps Chalet.

======================

"Uncle Harry dies Oct 12, 1977.

Meeting in the conference room of the Wierwille home (next to the fireplace room.)

Dr states "I don't think you know just how much Uncle Harry has done so that you could

have the Word today.' "

"Rise & Expansion. Dr commented that without genuine rise there would never be any

genuine expansion. Any expansion without genuine rise was counterfeit."

"E11ie Ray A11en shows everyone how to ride a motorcycle. Neigbor complains about the

noise. They tell him to get lost. When he hears of the neighbor threatening to call the cops,

Dr tells the guy, 'It's our land and we'll do whatever we want on it. Now crank it up, E11ie Ray!' "

"Protocol does not mean that you can't speak the truth."

"'The Marxist Minstrels' by Dr David Noble. He handled homosexuality and rock music and its

influences on culture today. Dr W had him come and do a paid speech to the Way Corps.

Dr informed him of the caliber of students that he was dealing with and that he should let it

rip and not hold back the gorey details, etc. He said that the Corps could handled anything

that he could throw at them."

"Dr Noble did not do as he was asked. He held back and ended up doing a bland speech.

Dr Wierwille reproved him afterwards and asked him to get back on track for his second

scheduled speech. Dr Noble responded like a champion. He accepted the reproof meekly

and did a magnificent job with the second speech."

"Dr Wierwille didn't hold back from speaking the truth in love no matter who the individual

was or what his position was. He handled it privately of course."

June 78-Advanced Class, Bristol England.

=================

"Get your preparation done ahead of time. Dr used to do a lot of his work while in flight. That way,

as soon as he arrived at the location, he was ready to lead and teach."

"He spent one day and night in Ireland on this trip. He had supper in a local restaurant with the

leadership."

"Dr had the whole class visit the grave of George Mueller. Dr had a great respect for people in history

who had significance on our ministry. Dr organized for the bristol twig to take care of the Mueller

gravesite. They still do so to this day."

"LCM starts to think in terms of our ministry and it not failing if and when Dr dies."

"Dr learned other histories and other cultures to help move the Word in those countries.

Why did Wesley's ministry basically fail when he died?

1) Wesley never saw through the Trinity.

2) He never spent enough time training leadership. He tried to do it all himself.

3) Towards the end of his life, his leadership began to quarrel among themselves.

We must innoculate the world with the truth of ONE GOD.

Dr had tremendous respect for great men.

Example of the man who designed the suspension bridge over the Avon river in Bristol. It was the

world's first suspension bridge. Dr wanted to be that good with the Word of God."

Location-Motor Coach (75 Coach.)

==============

"Having coaches certainly can add length to your life. Using proper equipment can be a real benefit

to someone. Sleeping in the same bed every night as opposed to a different hotel room each night

is beneficial to the health and well-being."

Location-Office of the Corps Chalet.

================

"Without meekness and a real love for the Word and the practical application of the Word, a man

can't really bless anyone.

Incidents of people on the research team leaving the ministry because they felt that they knew

better. Dr always demonstrated great love towards them."

(Next: Roa 1978 theme-'The Hope'.)

[hiway29]

WOW-the microphone behind the tie! Another first for VP !

The Marxist Minstrels- I remember such insight as The Monkees "I'm a Believer" being an ode to marijuana and the drug culture. The book was mainly an extreme right wing diatribe against leftists, communists,and drug pushers, which was just about anyone connected to the music industry . I 'ran' a state bookstore for a year, and often questioned why I was pushing that book and some others. I didn't question enough,unfortunately.

[Ham]

LCM and Donna leave on their trip and fail to say goodbye to Dr before they leave.

When they get back, Dr reproves them for the matter. He was genuinely hurt.

Dr always was thinking of HIS (?) people."

Hmmm. HE was genuinely hurt.. he reproved THEM.. sounds like he really cared.. only for HIMSELF.

Dr Wierwille didn't hold back from speaking the truth in love no matter who the individual

was or what his position was. He handled it privately of course.

Not that I was aware of.. my understanding, he roasted a few people with fire publically, because of MINOR errors, and "missing" etiquette and protocol that even Emily Post was not aware of..

He said that the Corps could handled anything

that he could throw at them.

Poor corps were sometimes so worn down from swinging from gluttony to starvation, besides lack of sleep, and verbal berating.. they'd believe anything..

We must innoculate the world with the truth of ONE GOD.

Sorry, I just HATE shots. Beat me with a hose, anything.. but please, no shots..

[Oakspear]

Interesting point, now that you mention it

I don't recall Craig ever once mentioning his real father.

Was his a broken family?

As far as I know, Martindale's parents and siblings all were involved in TWI at least up to the early to mid-nineties.

Martindale always spoke well of his father, who, as far as I know, is still alive. He told anecdotes about his father's great ability as a coach which he worked intyo his athletes of the spirit teachings. I met the man at a Word in Business or Advanced Class Special in Dallas one year and hung out with him on a smoke break. Seemed like a down-to-earth, level-headed guy

[Belle]

There's lots of contradictions in here..... One minute they're "fighting for the people" and the next they're in someone's face. :unsure: I think I'm beginning to see where Craig got his "I yell because I care" attitude.

And what's with making sure he points out every single compliment that vee pee gave him? He certainly is in Wonderland and I wonder how many of those compliments reallly happened and how many were said rather tongue in cheek.

[WordWolf]

ROA 1978 theme-"The Hope".

============

"If you really have something to suggest, then suggest it. If not, then say nothing! Don't suggest

something because you feel you are expected to. Doing that is dishonest. People in leadership need

to be able to trust in you and your opinion. If you make suggestions for the sake of making them,

tou are now causing the leader to think through your suggestion and decide whether it has merit

or not. You are making extra work for him or her. That's not honest!"

"Incident of a 6th Corps girl complaining to Dr that there was too much bad language. Dr

considered it and suggested that everyone in leadership should set the example. Less bad

language!"

"Incident of Dr landing in Anchorage Alaska on a commercial flight. The landing was ridiculously

bumpy. Dr commented to the woman beside him that if his pilot landed like that, he'd fire him.

He then used that as a door to witness to her."

"Dr was concerned that the younger people in the ministry might not be getting a fair shake at the

leadership responsibilities in the ministry. not get the opportunity to make their mark in the

ministry. He suggested that some of those on staff needed to go on the field and get off of staff

for a while. If the shoe fits, wear it. LCM considers leaving staff and asks Dr whether the advice

applied to him or not. Dr said no!"

"Dr didn't have the time to read everything sent to him and so the research team idea was developed."

LCM teaches R & E at the Advanced Class 79 at Athens Ohio.

============

"Dr teaches by example the proper placement of seats so that all students can have an unobstructed

view of the teacher."

"Dr reproves LCM for not being his best when teaching at the Advanced Class. He told him to get

it together. Do whatever needed to be done so that he was at his best for teaching. LCM realized

that he was trying to do too much with being an MC and all. He cut back on his other responsibilities

and got rested so that he performed much better."

"Dr stated to LCM, 'Son, you're seeing things and teaching things that I've known for years but

never documented from the Word.'"

"Part 3. The Master Student-the Future Unfolds."

===================

1980

===

"During the Adv Class 79, Dr announced that he would be retiring as president in the next few years

and that a new president would be picked. LCM had the thought that it would be him, but he didn't

dwell on it."

"Dr and LCM invite/request all the (in-residence and on-field) Corps to write their autobiographies.

Oct 79 was set for the deadline. Dr was hurt when not many responded to the deadline. LCM had not

done his yet either. Dr reproved LCM in front of the corps. How can you expect the younger Corps to

do something when the leadership didn't do it, either?

Dr displayed great love and tenderness to him the next morning by inviting him to lead the 10:30am

fellowship."

"Dr was very tired and weak when they were walking back to the coach one night while at Gunnison.

Dr had a hard time breathing, etc. LCM was extremely concerned. At the coach, Dr told LCM

'You remind me of Rufus Mosely, all the love he had for me!' "

"Sometimes the door to discuss certain things with people doesn't open. Example of whether LCM

should go back to college to get a degree. LCM was concerned that his lack of having a degree would

hinder him from moving the Word or helping in the ministry. Once a man or woman reaches the

level of ordination- 'there's no turning back'. An ordained person would die first before copping out!

Many, however, did cop out."

"Dr once said 'I wonder if you guys will be able to hold this ministry together after I'm gone, or will

you just bicker with each other and try and climb over each other?' "

"Incident of disagreement between Dr and LCM's dad. The subsequent resolution. The letter that

Dr wrote to his dad. The phone call and resolution."

[Ham]

"Dr stated to LCM, 'Son, you're seeing things and teaching things that I've known for years but

never documented from the Word.'"

RISE AND EXPANSION???? Something born of such a simple mind.. and vic never documented it?

I would say he was too doggone lazy to look it up..

"Dr didn't have the time to read everything sent to him and so the research team idea was developed."

I thought the "research team" was developed to rubber stamp even the most inane stuff to come off the old man's desk..

What a waste of some of the minds that were put in research.. jeeze.

"Incident of a 6th Corps girl complaining to Dr that there was too much bad language. Dr

considered it and suggested that everyone in leadership should set the example. Less bad

language!"

loy sure abandoned that strategy in fairly short order..

Incident of Dr landing in Anchorage Alaska on a commercial flight. The landing was ridiculously

bumpy. Dr commented to the woman beside him that if his pilot landed like that, he'd fire him.

He then used that as a door to witness to her.

To witness???!!

Lessee.. the ole codger.. claiming he had a pilot.. "HIS pilot".. and he'd FIRE him.. OMG.

"witnessing".. ptooie. I would think perhaps he just may have been trying to "impress" the lady.. but that is only my opinion..

(vic) teaches by example the proper placement of seats so that all students can have an unobstructed

view of the teacher."

For crying out loud.. you'd think that they would know how to string chairs by this time.. good grief..

teaches.. by EXAMPLE?? I question whether he had the time or inclination to get off his rear, and put all the stinking chairs where he thought they should be..